Are spirits electromagnetic energy?

I do wonder if you're actually being serious, David.  Obviously the emotion one may feel listening to Mozart is generated in your own head. You're not suggesting that radio waves carry with them the actual feelings and emotions. They are a secondary facsilime. 

When you are communicating your emotions down the telephone, you're not actually sending your soul down the phone (through the wires or the ether), you're sending a copy of your voiced words representing your emotion.

First, I'd like to remind you that I explained that I don't particularly support the electromagnetic idea, but I think we shouldn't fall into the materialist approach of just ruling certain things out, and even distorting the raw evidence to the same end.

The crucial thing, I think, is that the spirit realm and our realm DO interact. If they didn't we would be in the afterlife and the Earth would be some sort of dead place.

Talking about that interaction is always going to be a tricky subject.

David

I don't see things that way. What you are talking about there is the power of art to move us. Art as a form of mind-to-mind communication. Whether it is literature, music, painting, dance, theatre or cinema, these are indirect ways of sharing an inner state of mind with others. The use of electromagnetic waves or electron flow is not really the point, pigment on canvas also conveys emotion, as does ink on a page. But the key word is Art. That is the tool being used, the physical medium is not the message.

I'm not sure I see it that way either, but as I explained to Tim, the real problem is that the two realms are not completely isolated - there is interaction. Indeed, I think in all probability we are all spirit even when we think we are on earth. This is precisely what makes the hard problem hard.

If the interaction isn't mediated by electromagnetism, what is it mediated by?

David

First, I'd like to remind you that I explained that I don't particularly support the electromagnetic idea, but I think we shouldn't fall into the materialist approach of just ruling certain things out, and even distorting the raw evidence to the same end.

Who's distorting raw evidence ? What evidence is there that minds are composed of electricity or electromagnetism? 

The crucial thing, I think, is that the spirit realm and our realm DO interact.

It's not crucial, at all and it doesn't follow therefore that the laws of physics also apply there.

If they didn't we would be in the afterlife and the Earth would be some sort of dead place.

 
Honestly, I don't know what you're talking about, David.

Talking about that interaction is always going to be a tricky subject.

Nor for me. I don't waste my time (usually). I tend to think Jung was spot on when he said if there's a question that can't be answered, drop it. (for instance why did the universe come into existence)

We can't know the nature of the next world(s) or before world or whatever it is and never will. But to get to the crux of the matter, if you prefer not to rule out electromagnetism as a candidate to explain psychic phenomena and even the mind/psyche itself, feel free, I'm not stopping you. Just don't expect me to pay any attention to it, because I won't.

I'll go on strike when I'm reading your posts, David ! Down tools (glasses off) work to rule... electromagnetism OUT ...out out OUT !! Just kidding BTW

[Ninshub]

I'm not sure I see it that way either, but as I explained to Tim, the real problem is that the two realms are not completely isolated - there is interaction. Indeed, I think in all probability we are all spirit even when we think we are on earth. This is precisely what makes the hard problem hard.

If the interaction isn't mediated by electromagnetism, what is it mediated by?

David

This presupposes the planes are completely distinct and there needs to be interaction or mediation. I tend to think the entire physical universe is a creation by Spirit (spirits) as one reality system among many, set up as a sort of virtual reality game with its own limits and rule-sets, for learning, growth and experience. So it's all consciousness or Spirit or whatever you want to call it. Made by Spirit of Spirit for Spirit.

I'm not sure I see it that way either, but as I explained to Tim, the real problem is that the two realms are not completely isolated - there is interaction. Indeed, I think in all probability we are all spirit even when we think we are on earth. This is precisely what makes the hard problem hard.

If the interaction isn't mediated by electromagnetism, what is it mediated by?

David

To help my physics understanding...when we talk about "fields" what we are talking about are measurements that we think have an effect on other measurements...right?

It's hard to grasp what a field is otherwise, at least for me...

I'm not sure I see it that way either, but as I explained to Tim, the real problem is that the two realms are not completely isolated - there is interaction. Indeed, I think in all probability we are all spirit even when we think we are on earth. This is precisely what makes the hard problem hard.

If the interaction isn't mediated by electromagnetism, what is it mediated by?

David

If the mind-body interaction were mediated by electromagnetism, our minds would go haywire whenever we had an MRI of our brain, since our brain would be subjected to a very strong magnetic flux during such a magnetic resonance imaging scan. Other examples would be coming anywhere near to a radio or television or radar transmitter, for instance. Whatever it is, it isn't electromagnetism. In any case, the notion of some physical parameters being "mediated" by some sort of a "field" seems to really be in essence a measurement or description of a correlation of effects, the lawlike way certain physical relationships just happen to happen in our spacetime. Why can't the mind complexly interact with the particular specialized microstructure of the brain because that is the way our spacetime and our minds were designed by the "powers that be"?

[Ninshub]

If the mind-body interaction were mediated by electromagnetism, our minds would go haywire whenever we had an MRI of our brain, since our brain would be subjected to a very strong magnetic flux during such a magnetic resonance imaging scan.

At the same time, how do we account for people's minds (or whatever energy they have) seeming to make electromagnetic equipment go haywire?

I bring this up because the same animal medium I brought up earlier in this thread in one of her videos explained how she came to discover she had her abilities and do the work she does. And one of the points in that journey involved her going precisely to an MRI center (attached to the Rhine Center/Duke University in North Carolina, I think, where as a young girl she had been tested and labeled as having abilities, which she didn't do anything about) and having the doctor/radiology professor's X-ray showing equipment react whenever she entered or left the room.

Between 2 and 5.30 minutes approximately:

At the same time, how do we account for people's minds (or whatever energy they have) seeming to make electromagnetic equipment go haywire?

I don't know, Ian would be the only answer I have. "Spirits" (whatever they are) seem to be able to do that with ease, don't they. But nbtruthman has conclusively (I would say) spelt it out why our minds are not that.

[Ninshub]

"Spirits" (whatever they are) seem to be able to do that with ease, don't they.

But in this case it's the medium herself (a spirit embodied) who, just by her presence in the room, involuntarily (andwho at the time did know she had those gifts to that degree), seems to effect human technology. (Although as I write this I realize it could be disembodied spirits around her that are responsible; however intuitively if I was to venture a guess I would bet on that not being the cause.)