Are spirits electromagnetic energy?

I don't think so. In addition to the phenomena not obeying the inverse square law of distance and intensity, telepathy and clairvoyance, etc. violate too many other principles of electromagnetic propagation, such as the lack of any effect of shielding in Faraday cages for instance. And there is an even more fundamental disconnect, where precognition and retrocognition violate basic causality in addition to the electromagnetic laws.

I wasn't necessarily equating all psi phenomena with something x-electromagnetic (i.e. expanded electromagnetism).

I think it is also worth pointing out that radio waves may vary in amplitude over several orders of magnitude, and yet convey the same information. I.e. the inverse square law might not be as relevant as we tend to assume.

I don't want to push this idea too hard, but I really prefer to keep ideas on the table rather than sweep them aside in ways that may miss the point.

David

I really prefer to keep ideas on the table rather than sweep them aside in ways that may miss the point.

You can keep them on your own table, David, but they're not coming on mine.

Of course you can Sci, everyone is free to see things however they wish. For me, the answer would have to be no, though. 

 (from the link)  However, if the brain is itself an intrinsically luminous structure. 

I'm not sugesting that our brains are not incredible machines, they are. Materialists think they are even more incredible, that they create consciousness. But I'm convinced (enough) that they don't, so with that in mind and the fact that some people seem to be able to manage without a brain (well 90% of it missing) I'm convinced it's the mind that is the 'luminous' structure.

I agree mind is not brain, and of the two it is infinitely more wonderous...I just don't want to let the materialist pseudo-skeptics even have the brain.

I think it is also worth pointing out that radio waves may vary in amplitude over several orders of magnitude, and yet convey the same information. I.e. the inverse square law might not be as relevant as we tend to assume.

Radio waves can't convey raw thoughts, feelings and emotions. Radio waves also can't penetrate Faraday cages, and so couldn't convey any information about locations beyond it.

[Ninshub]

For me, such ideas as electromagnetic energy and frequency, vibration and so on are not to be taken to mean the same thing that they do in physics and mainstream science. The ideas may be taken metaphorically, mystically, poetically and in that way might have some ability to express an idea. But to take such terms literally, to imagine that spirits are composed of photons causes problems, it is an obstacle to trying to make sense of things.

From your post and a lot of the others here, I gather mediums (and other experiencers) contact something akin to a vibrant, "easily detectable" but subtle non-physical "energy" (or life source or however you want to call it) and some, probably wrongly, equate it with physical energy like EM. What we can't deny is there are parallels between how the spiritual world is very consistently described by all kinds of experiencers (energy, vibration, frequency, etc. etc.) and the "equivalents" in the physical plane. As if there's some mirroring going on between the planes.

Radio waves can't convey raw thoughts, feelings and emotions. Radio waves also can't penetrate Faraday cages, and so couldn't convey any information about locations beyond it.

My main feeling is that we should not do what materialists do, and bend the evidence to suit our belief system. The idea that electromagnetic phenomena are somehow linked with the larger reality does pop up over and over again. So also does the idea that the larger reality is to be found in another dimension extending the 3/4 dimensions we usually recognise.

https://www.newthinkingallowed.org/hyper...nard-carr/

Light is an electromagnetic wave, and it can obviously penetrate a Faraday cage made of copper gauze because its wavelength is shorter than the holes in the cage.

Also, I don't know exactly what you mean by 'raw emotion', but emotions are easily transmitted electronically - just turn on a radio and listen to Mozart -Piano Concerto No 23 A major K 488. Even YouTube will do, because the signal probably arrives at your PC via WiFi.

David

Also, I don't know exactly what you mean by 'raw emotion', but emotions are easily transmitted electronically - just turn on a radio and listen to Mozart -Piano Concerto No 23 A major K 488. Even YouTube will do, because the signal probably arrives at your PC via WiFi.

I don't see things that way. What you are talking about there is the power of art to move us. Art as a form of mind-to-mind communication. Whether it is literature, music, painting, dance, theatre or cinema, these are indirect ways of sharing an inner state of mind with others. The use of electromagnetic waves or electron flow is not really the point, pigment on canvas also conveys emotion, as does ink on a page. But the key word is Art. That is the tool being used, the physical medium is not the message.

Also, I don't know exactly what you mean by 'raw emotion', but emotions are easily transmitted electronically - just turn on a radio and listen to Mozart -Piano Concerto No 23 A major K 488. Even YouTube will do, because the signal probably arrives at your PC via WiFi.

I do wonder if you're actually being serious, David.  Obviously the emotion one may feel listening to Mozart is generated in your own head. You're not suggesting that radio waves carry with them the actual feelings and emotions. They are a secondary facsilime. 

When you are communicating your emotions down the telephone, you're not actually sending your soul down the phone (through the wires or the ether), you're sending a copy of your voiced words representing your emotion.

From your post and a lot of the others here, I gather mediums (and other experiencers) contact something akin to a vibrant, "easily detectable" but subtle non-physical "energy" (or life source or however you want to call it) and some, probably wrongly, equate it with physical energy like EM. What we can't deny is there are parallels between how the spiritual world is very consistently described by all kinds of experiencers (energy, vibration, frequency, etc. etc.) and the "equivalents" in the physical plane. As if there's some mirroring going on between the planes.

It is described like that, Ian. But we can only use the language we have here, the metaphors we favour. I don't know what the next world is like (I wish I did) but having spoken to so many (now) genuine people that have seen it (or claimed to have seen it, sorry sceptics) it's nothing like this world, nothing that can be imagined or deduced.

We make observations. Then we join those observations together with stories that we've made-up. If a story is useful (predictive) we use it. When a better story is made-up we use that instead. Electromagnetism (EM) is just a story. An apparently useful one, but it's still just a story used to join our experiences together.

Take the magnetic component of EM. Anyone who has attempted to push two opposing iron magnets together will be convinced of the presence of what we call the magnetic 'force', but we've only been able to understand that with a new theory. That new theory also doesn't fit with gravity (relativity).

They are attempting to come up with a new generalized theory to deal with the growing problems in physics, and they have been motivated to re-understand things, by getting rid of the things we don't actually observe, like fudged virtual particles, and esoteric model spaces that don't resemble our experience here. I'm convinced they are going to achieve it in my life time. What they've come up with so far is truly amazing, honestly it's mind blowing and humbling, and it seems like there is some combinatorial object/shape that lies behind everything. The kinematic shape of that object, here in our everyday experience, looks very biological-like to me.

If you've followed what I've written (which I doubt), I'm speculating things have come full circle, right back to us. Then you start to wonder about other things... bad things... very bad things... :-(