(2019-06-12, 07:08 PM)Chris Wrote: [ -> ]We must be thankful that doctors and academics don't know how to use the Internet.
Well, I suppose they do
but it's still different giving a private interview and talking at an academic lecture.
(2019-06-12, 06:55 PM)Raf999 Wrote: [ -> ]he can't really talk about consciousness
He can't talk about consciousness existing outside of the brain, no. Not to 95% (?) of them.
(2019-06-12, 08:20 PM)tim Wrote: [ -> ]He can't talk about consciousness existing outside of the brain, no. Not to 95% (?) of them.
Yes, imagine the commotion if during that talk he would have stated that consciousness survives death of the brain.
(2019-06-12, 08:47 PM)Raf999 Wrote: [ -> ]Yes, imagine the commotion if during that talk he would have stated that consciousness survives death of the brain.
But Parnia has never gone that far in anything I've heard him say, over many years. What he does say, consistently, is that consciousness continues, at least for a limited time, after death. But if anyone challenges him on that he supports it with facts and detailed explanations.
Occasionally he has been asked what he himself personally believes. I know on one occasion he more or less said, he didn't believe anything. He could speculate, but that is not the same as knowing. All he could offer was the facts.
The picture of "doctors and academics" overwhelmingly having a materialist worldview isn't supported by the evidence.
A quick Google produced a couple of surveys. They are 10-15 years old but probably with more effort some more recent figures could be found.
One from 2009 showed that in the USA, just over half of professional scientists believe in either God or "a universal spirit or higher power." Even in the most sceptical field shown - physics and astronomy - the figures were 29% God and another 14% spirit/power:
https://www.pewforum.org/2009/11/05/scie...nd-belief/
A survey of doctors in the USA in 2005 showed that "76 percent said they believe in God, 59 percent said they believe in some sort of afterlife, and 55 percent said their religious beliefs influence how they practice medicine."
http://www.nbcnews.com/id/8318894/ns/hea...afterlife/
(2019-06-13, 07:20 AM)Chris Wrote: [ -> ]The picture of "doctors and academics" overwhelmingly having a materialist worldview isn't supported by the evidence.
A quick Google produced a couple of surveys. They are 10-15 years old but probably with more effort some more recent figures could be found.
One from 2009 showed that in the USA, just over half of professional scientists believe in either God or "a universal spirit or higher power." Even in the most sceptical field shown - physics and astronomy - the figures were 29% God and another 14% spirit/power:
https://www.pewforum.org/2009/11/05/scie...nd-belief/
A survey of doctors in the USA in 2005 showed that "76 percent said they believe in God, 59 percent said they believe in some sort of afterlife, and 55 percent said their religious beliefs influence how they practice medicine."
http://www.nbcnews.com/id/8318894/ns/hea...afterlife/
Interesting, although having some form of belief isn't the same as accepting consciousness outside of the body. There are many believers who think that NDEs can't be real (or even are an artifact of the devil) because they don't fit in their religious system.
(2019-06-13, 05:28 AM)Typoz Wrote: [ -> ]Parnia has never gone that far in anything I've heard him say, over many years
He actually
did in one in depth US radio interview, Typoz. But as you say, it's generally just the assertion that "our sense of self" doesn't seem to be annihilated in the first period after death when the brain is not functioning.
It's a difficult situation to handle. You've got people like French and Blackmore (particularly the latter) slapping their legs and tittering at the very thought of disembodied consciousness. She wants to measure something and Parnia can't give her anything.
Edit : Sorry, that sounds a bit risqué, wasn't meant to be
(2019-06-13, 01:58 PM)tim Wrote: [ -> ] Sorry, that sounds a bit risqué, wasn't meant to be
Ooh suits YOU sir - oooh.
Well, I think anyway it would be premature for an MD to declare that consciousness survives death of the body with certainty. i mean yes, the body of evidence is vast and growing each year, but until we get a true and verified "hit" (fingers crossed for AWARE II) some space, albeit small, for materialistic explanations ofthe phenomena is still there and you would expose yourself a bit too much.
I find Parnia's approach very good, he is cool and relaxed and doesn't give out too many information in his presentations. in this way he kinda keeps a low profile, gets money for his projects (yeah, AWARE II being disguised as a resuscitation project is really just a way to cover up consciousness studies imo), and when the time is right he'll reveal the results professionaly, not earlier.
There isn't really any space left for the Physicalist explanation.
There's simply too much overall evidence from the plethora of NDE and reincarnation memory recall cases.