Psience Quest

There's another longer interview with Hamish here 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QKTV0J1xJFM

I would have posted this years ago but for his use of odd adjectives (aluminium tube for instance). It's not a criticism,
it's just that sceptics seize on anything that sounds implausible or hallucinatory..."He said he was an aluminium tube? Well that means he's off his nut!" When in fact it's more likely than not just his way of putting it, maybe.

(2020-07-08, 05:28 PM)tim Wrote: [ -> ]There's another longer interview with Hamish here 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QKTV0J1xJFM

I would have posted this years ago but for his use of odd adjectives (aluminium tube for instance). It's not a criticism,
it's just that sceptics seize on anything that sounds implausible or hallucinatory..."He said he was an aluminium tube? Well that means he's off his nut!" When in fact it's more likely than not just his way of putting it, maybe.

 Very interesting. Thanks Tim.

I'd personally never heard of this Virginia doctor (maybe others have) until I saw him quoted on a Dr Peter Fenwick video in relation to end of life issues. It's apparent he also has a lot to say about environmental/planetary issues and the catastrophic problems we will face if we don't change our ways (which may well be true and then again it may be over exaggerated ?) but make of it what you will. 

I do find it interesting that patients seem almost without exception to regret being brought back to life. Why should that be if we're only biological robots ? 

He goes on to point out examples of people who have biologically died but have been brought back to life. These are the people who’ve experienced what we’ve come to call near death experiences, a remarkable phenomenon in which people from all ages, backgrounds, ethnicities, cultures, and so on, all share a very common experience.

"And what I’ve seen it to be is a massive expansion, of consciousness, of reality, of awareness, and ultimately of love." 

As an ICU doctor, Bush was a first hand witness to resuscitation of many patients, and he expresses his awe with the fact that the most common thing a patient would first say after being brought back to life was, ‘why did you bring me back?’

"In the hours that follow, they are telling their loved ones, ‘I went into this space, and it was bright white light everywhere, and in that moment I felt completely accepted for the first time in my life." ~Zach Bush, MD

https://nexusnewsfeed.com/article/consci...ath-that-y

 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aLaVutWXju0

Ed Kelly chatting to John Cleese about evidence for survival, particularly NDE's. Kelly deals with the crux of the matter 
to perfection around the eleven minute mark. 

 https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_conti...e=emb_logo

Further thoughts  https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_conti...e=emb_logo

Former anaesthesiologist Chris Yerington is talking here about his now well known case of "Frank", the 'dead' patient who wasn't expected to survive but somehow did..and somehow reported the conversations from the ER. Even more impressively, he reported seeing and remembering a seven(?) digit number from the top of the lights in the OR.
    
I think this interview is a real 'coup' but unfortunately, the beginning has been spoilt by a fault in communications. Don't give up on it though, it's worth sticking with. He deals with it not from a believer's perspective but a hard nosed sceptic, and considers even the most outlandish and unrealistic explanations, some of which even I know (as a layperson) are out of the question from my own investigations (and listening to experts)  

At 53.15, the host brings up a question that some of our own sceptics on here would address to him, even if not directly, they would still certainly think it a possibility, namely how do we know he's been thorough with his investigation and how do we know he's not lying ?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_conti...e=emb_logo

Edit:

Yerington is quite active on Quora and I saw this recently which is very interesting.

Just this past year, actually, in early 2019, in my brother’s group… one of the guys had a case of recall  (the term used to describe both anaesthesia awareness and NDE's by medical professionals) that was just not physically possible and it crushed that doctor’s granite-belief in the purely physical existence that is relied upon for us, physicians, to focus on healing the body.

When I hear from friends, colleague of more often, friends of friends of colleagues about this type of story I give them the contact information for groups that currently study it and interview the medical personnel… that was ‘strongly discouraged’ in my day in the hospital. My brother, an anesthesiologist, has had one of his colleagues go through this experience this year and it ‘freaked’ him out a little bit about the unknown(s) of the human journey. It can be unsettling when you have a firm grasp on your own personal perception of reality and then something occurs that can’t be… it pierces your abstract mind and then lingers until addressed… even, or perhaps especially, in the mind and heart of a very well educated physician.

https://www.quora.com/As-an-anesthesiolo...eone-under

He seems to respond to everyone except me, for some reason. If anyone else is interested in asking him for more details about this case, it might prove useful.

(2020-08-03, 01:17 PM)tim Wrote: [ -> ]See edited post above (Yerington) I'll delete this soon.

Very interesting recording Tim thanks. I thought the potentially evidentially element was very curious. I was turned off by his waffling explanation of how it might have happened. It seems to me that quite often  people have experiences which in themselves appear genuine then attempt to explain it when often they’re simply speculating in areas which are not their specialist area. He’s not the first Imho, some of the stars of psychical research have done the same thing.

I guess Dr Yerington has one specific experience (or someone he knows has). I’d be wary of explaining consciousness based on that, particularly given the body of evidence. 

What I did like is that it’s clearly puzzling him, and his explanations sounded like an understandable attempt to make it fit the model he’s comfortable with. After 22 minutes he’d got nowhere near explaining how the patient remembered the serial number. I did wonder if the  serial number was unique.

Thanks again. Hope my comments don’t sound churlish.

(2020-08-03, 10:12 PM)Obiwan Wrote: [ -> ]Very interesting recording Tim thanks. I thought the potentially evidentially element was very curious. I was turned off by his waffling explanation of how it might have happened. It seems to me that quite often  people have experiences which in themselves appear genuine then attempt to explain it when often they’re simply speculating in areas which are not their specialist area. He’s not the first Imho, some of the stars of psychical research have done the same thing.

I guess Dr Yerington has one specific experience (or someone he knows has). I’d be wary of explaining consciousness based on that, particularly given the body of evidence. 

What I did like is that it’s clearly puzzling him, and his explanations sounded like an understandable attempt to make it fit the model he’s comfortable with. After 22 minutes he’d got nowhere near explaining how the patient remembered the serial number. I did wonder if the  serial number was unique.

Thanks again. Hope my comments don’t sound churlish.

No, good pertinent comments Obiwan ! He mentions during the interview that he wasn't certain he'd taped the patient's eyes shut but he's made several statements already (previously) that he did. The patient was dead anyway (he tells us). He also mentions CPR as a possible restorer of consciousness but other experts are adamant that CPR cannot restore consciousness in
patients who's heart and circulation have stopped for more than a brief period.

He speculates about the lights being inverted (turned upside down) for what reason though ? Surely they wouldn't invert lights directly over the patient, there would be a potential problem with dust ? (at the least). Then he said the lights were not actually over the patient, but somewhere away from him, so I don't think that's a realistic possibility anyway, apart from the fact that dead patients can't see. 

It's another good case if he's telling us the truth of course and I have little reason to think otherwise. As to his speculations about quantum physics and consciousness it's anyone's guess but personally I suspect the separating mind, psyche, soul is not operating on that basis, but of course I might be completely wrong.

Just a further note which I think is relevant (which I posted on the video comments section),  with relation to Dr Yerington's hypothesis that the patient's eyes MIGHT have been open at the beginning, before he taped them shut...@49.07 he tells us that "Frank" was cold and that his temperature was 32 degrees C. For every one degree of temperature drop, there is a loss of brain function between 6-10%.
   
"The temperature-dependent nature of cerebral functional activity has also been well reported. For example, impairment of memory encoding starts at a body temperature of 36.7°C and progresses to the point that 70% of information normally retained is lost at approximately 34–35°C (Coleshaw et al., 1983)."

Also at 32 degrees, the pupils dilate (Weinberg 1993). So considering that the patient was dead and receiving CPR to try to perfuse his brain (which can only achieve about 25-30% of normal blood flow required by the brain according to experts)  which is the most sensitive organ in the body in respect of the need for blood, then this patient having any kind of normal consciousness at all is actually out of the question.

Sorry to be pedantic but sceptics will clutch at anything and the facts need to be presented fully. Naturally, a determined sceptic may just say that Yerington's memory could be faulty or even that he's making it up, and there's nothing that can be done about that of course. 

Edit : The patient said there was a  "spider" on the surgeon's head
 @1.17.14

A near death experience transforms a doctor and her practice : Dr Rana Awdish on Health Professional radio

This is a good example of a previously sceptical doctor experiencing an NDE for herself and then changing her mind. If NDE's are confabulations, she had no reason at all to confabulate or expect to have one. Was this doctor simply fooled by her own senses against her previous rigorous scientific instinct ?  

....The final day of my fellowship training at Henry Ford hospital and I was seven months pregnant....I had sudden onset abdominal
 pain....and what that pain was (was) a tumour in my liver that burst open and it was an arterial bleed that gushes very fast powered by the heart....I was then in an operating room in multi organ failure.

I could hear the anaesthesiologist say "we're losing her" and I thought to myself--you'd better pay attention...this sounds bad....
I knew I had lost all my blood volume into my abdomen, I heard my "labs" repeated (blood gasses etc), my liver was failing, my kidneys were failing and when I tried to look at the room, I realised I could see the whole room and in fact I could see myself on the table as well as the doctors who were working to extract the baby...and I thought, you know what, they're right, they are losing me if I can see myself I might already be lost....and certainly I was not somebody who believed in near death experiences that had been articulated by my patients. 

I studied neuroscience and I thought it was just faulty wiring of the brain that was anoxic. And then I had that experience that everyone talks about...I felt small and weightless and yet expansive as if I was a part of everything and able to observe, yet completely impartial. I didn't feel attached to what I was watching even though it was my own death..

(Host) .....were you okay with what was happening to you ?

....y'know, I went into that hospital in horrific pain...and what I remembered in that moment....was that not only was the pain gone but I felt completely at peace, just the most peaceful feeling I had ever had in my life. 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JqMfw890Cv8