(2021-01-26, 04:12 PM)tim Wrote: [ -> ]Neal Grossman, Stephen A Schwartz, moderator Jan Holden, Marjorie Woollacott and Eben Alexander discuss how to deal with 'scepticism'.
At around 13.00 Alexander highlights the problem very articulately.
Near-Death Experiences- Dealing with Skepticism (Panel Discussion) - YouTube
(Schwartz) The central thing you learn about dealing with scepticism is it's mediocrity. Some years ago I was asked by ABC news to take part in a debate
with a neuro-physicist named Jerre Levy ? and a sceptic (philosopher) Dan Dennett....When it came my turn to speak, I looked at Dennett and said
Since you have very strong feelings about this subject, I can only assume that you have taken the time to deeply reach into the literature and deeply
critique it....Dennett looked at me in such a condescending tone and said, " You don't think I actually read this stuff do you ?"
At 32.32 Neal Grossman is in good form, likening NDE "sceptics" as comparable to creationists who refuse to acknowledge the rock formations of the Grand Canyon as having any significance. Also a nice mention of Rivas and Smit's book 'The Self Does Not Die'.
Sure. When you know the answer, why let facts get in the way lol
(2021-01-26, 04:12 PM)tim Wrote: [ -> ]Neal Grossman, Stephen A Schwartz, moderator Jan Holden, Marjorie Woollacott and Eben Alexander discuss how to deal with 'scepticism'.
At around 13.00 Alexander highlights the problem very articulately.
Near-Death Experiences- Dealing with Skepticism (Panel Discussion) - YouTube
(Schwartz) The central thing you learn about dealing with scepticism is it's mediocrity. Some years ago I was asked by ABC news to take part in a debate
with a neuro-physicist named Jerre Levy ? and a sceptic (philosopher) Dan Dennett....When it came my turn to speak, I looked at Dennett and said
Since you have very strong feelings about this subject, I can only assume that you have taken the time to deeply reach into the literature and deeply
critique it....Dennett looked at me in such a condescending tone and said, " You don't think I actually read this stuff do you ?"
At 32.32 Neal Grossman is in good form, likening NDE "sceptics" as comparable to creationists who refuse to acknowledge the rock formations of the Grand Canyon as having any significance. Also a nice mention of Rivas and Smit's book 'The Self Does Not Die'.
Hi all!
Yes, I have not logged on to this excellent forum for quite some time.
Sorry for that... my attention focussed on other matters over the past year or so.
I want to thank Tim for bringing up this video, particularly so because Neal Grossman praises our book The Self Does Not Die. Also, near the end Eben Alexander adds to this praise.
BTW, the book has now sold 4000 copies. We hope to publish as new edition in due course.
For all of you, keep up the good work!
Cheers - Smithy
(2021-01-10, 12:27 PM)Stan Woolley Wrote: [ -> ]In the video above, the lady says, as is often the case with NDErs, that she has totally lost all fear of death.
It surely must be hard having a total lack of fear of death, I ask myself about accommodating this into our daily life. If people started believing in the afterlife in large numbers, how many would give up living a full life here and so commit suicide?
I seems to me, to have this information requires a more complex all round picture. If people simply took on board this one idea, I think it might cause more problems than it would solve. Having an NDE is often a very complex emotional experience, I can maybe see the reason that certain things are withheld or given to individuals before they come back.
I think the question of suicide is not connected with the idea of living a full life. It seems to me that fear - in general, not of anything in particular, fear is the thing which stops people from living a full life. A very small proportion of NDE experiences seem to lead towards a wish to end their own life. But one must counterbalance that with the cases of attempted suicide where after an NDE, the person returns to this life newly invigorated. Far from wanting to attempt it again, their aim is to embrace this life while they can, to live it fully.
In my assessment - for what little it is worth, it seems the effect of an NDE on the person may be disruptive, it may break up relationships or result in a change of career direction. But amid all that disruption is (in my view) a determination to do
something in this life. When I say 'something', there are a few who have some sort of specific task or role to fulfil afterwards. But others, they return, know they are here for a reason, but cannot say what it is. It seems to me that means the reason must simply be to be here, to get through things somehow. Just living an ordinary life seems to have significance, to be of value. Perhaps there's something there for all of us. We can consider our lives and ourselves to be of value, no matter who we are or in what situation we find ourselves.
(2021-01-29, 01:13 PM)Smithy Wrote: [ -> ]Hi all!
Yes, I have not logged on to this excellent forum for quite some time.
Sorry for that... my attention focussed on other matters over the past year or so.
I want to thank Tim for bringing up this video, particularly so because Neal Grossman praises our book The Self Does Not Die. Also, near the end Eben Alexander adds to this praise.
BTW, the book has now sold 4000 copies. We hope to publish as new edition in due course.
For all of you, keep up the good work!
Cheers - Smithy
It's an excellent book, Smithy! Titus, yourself and Annie Dirven of course (now sadly deceased but somewhere better, I'm sure) fully deserve Grossman's and Alexander's praise!
For me, although I may of course be slightly biased (as a small contributor), it's the best book out there as regards getting to the point of the debate, presenting the evidence with additional expert comment and medical facts, and dealing with the objections of the sceptics.
There'll be another '0' on the end of the 4000 sold, in the next decade.
Swiss Doctor Hedi Meierhans talks about some of the near death experiences (briefly) of her patients and how they could be used to bring about positive changes in the world. She very much reminds me of the pioneer of this subject, Elizabeth Kubler Ross.
Near death experiences have what it takes to undermine (destructive forces) terrorism and dogmatism and if children were able to grow up knowing about an inter-denominational ethics based on love and solidarity, then there would be fewer wars.
Because there really isn't just what we see with our eyes...everyone knows that. But nevertheless, (many) people behave there is nothing beyond that and it's just not true and I think it's very important that people know that, because this knowledge could change society for the better!
Analyse von Nahtod- und Jenseitsberichten. Interview mit Frau Dr. med. Hedi Meierhans - YouTube
With many thanks to
EmpirischeJenseitsforschung
(2021-01-26, 04:12 PM)tim Wrote: [ -> ]Neal Grossman, Stephen A Schwartz, moderator Jan Holden, Marjorie Woollacott and Eben Alexander discuss how to deal with 'scepticism'.
At around 13.00 Alexander highlights the problem very articulately.
Near-Death Experiences- Dealing with Skepticism (Panel Discussion) - YouTube
(Schwartz) The central thing you learn about dealing with scepticism is it's mediocrity. Some years ago I was asked by ABC news to take part in a debate
with a neuro-physicist named Jerre Levy ? and a sceptic (philosopher) Dan Dennett....When it came my turn to speak, I looked at Dennett and said
Since you have very strong feelings about this subject, I can only assume that you have taken the time to deeply reach into the literature and deeply
critique it....Dennett looked at me in such a condescending tone and said, " You don't think I actually read this stuff do you ?"
At 32.32 Neal Grossman is in good form, likening NDE "sceptics" as comparable to creationists who refuse to acknowledge the rock formations of the Grand Canyon as having any significance. Also a nice mention of Rivas and Smit's book 'The Self Does Not Die'.
It never ceases to amaze me that one
of the only skeptic's responses to this I've seen sums up their argument quite well. To paraphrase:
"I'm not listening to the rest (
he only watched the first minute) because
they're all liars or deluded...They were never skeptics...It's impossible that they could change their minds...They must be ignorant".
A part of me suspects this is a troll trying to be ironic because I simply can't believe there are 'skeptics' out there with such a lack of self-awareness, and being simply that close-minded and arrogant, that they act as though it's all some grand conspiracy.
I've seen this logic before though: "No such thing as a skeptic turned believer. They simply weren't skeptical enough, or are a liar". Again, reminds me of paranoid conspiracy thinking a bit.
It’s by no means the first time a so-called “sceptic” has pontificated on a psi-related subject only to be exposed as not having looked at the data.
I searched for this video, as I was sure I must have posted it before. I did, but it is ‘no longer available’, so I’ll post it here. I really feel like this is one of the more revealing of such videos. In many cases people report their NDEs, amazing experiences, without having any real idea what they were about. Natalie appears to know a lot more than most, imo.
I’ll try posting the vid later, as it wouldn’t post, despite me having just watched it!
(2021-02-21, 10:04 AM)Stan Woolley Wrote: [ -> ]Natalie appears to know a lot more than most, imo.
Yes, she has something to say. I actually bought her book, but have not read it yet, it's queued in my seemingly endless reading list.