Discovery Institute doesn’t believe in nuts&bolts aliens

In two recent articles they make the same argument as I have made about the improbability of anything extrasolar flying around here:

https://mindmatters.ai/2024/06/interstel...r-destiny/

Using Einstein’s special relativity formula for kinetic energy, and assuming a mass for the spaceship equivalent to that of a fully loaded 747 aircraft (m=400,000 kg), we find that the energy needed to accelerate the spaceship to the cruising velocity of 0.99c is 70 quadrillion kWh. Assuming that the astronauts want to stop at the distant star system, we’ll need to double this amount to account for deceleration, for the spaceship to make the one-way journey from Earth to the distant star.
So, just how much energy is 140 quadrillion kWh? Believe it or not, it’s equivalent to 4,800 times the total energy consumption of the United States in the year 2022. This means all the electricity, petroleum, natural gas, and any other form of energy used to power everything in the U.S. for one year would be 4,800 times too small to get our modest-sized spaceship to a relatively nearby star in a reasonable amount of time. I think it’s fair to say that interstellar space travel isn’t even remotely possible with our current understanding of physics and technology.

I think just about everyone who has looked into the nuts & bolts hypothesis has agreed conventional known physics makes it impossible?

What I think the nuts & bolts people insist on is that the vehicles rely on some as yet unknown physics knowledge. 

To my knowledge, however, there are no clear indicators of space ships from other planets.

These articles tell me that the Discovery Institute, which I believe is a relatively unknown institution in Europe, is a curious thing. They clearly adhere largely to the scientific methodology in their arguments. What sets them apart from the mainstream seems mainly to be their questions about the origin of life and the evolution of life. There’s much to like about them, as I think they are great at calling out unjustified extrapolations of mainstream science and insisting that atheism doesn’t need to be a hidden prior assumption in scientific discovery. Labeling everything they do as “pseudoscience” seems very unfair to me; they do science a great favor by asking all those skeptical questions.

Now the interesting question is why they spend column spaces arguing against ufos. It clearly must fit into their overall ideology that Earth is a rather unique place.

Now the interesting question is why they spend column spaces arguing against ufos. It clearly must fit into their overall ideology that Earth is a rather unique place.

If we assume that it is difficult or impossible to get a nuts-and-bolts craft from another star system to reach our solar system, it would be impossible to conclude anything at all about the uniqueness of Earth. In fact, inherent in those Einsteinian calculations, the assumption is made that other worlds would be like ours and use similar technologies.

If we assume that it is difficult or impossible to get a nuts-and-bolts craft from another star system to reach our solar system, it would be impossible to conclude anything at all about the uniqueness of Earth. In fact, inherent in those Einsteinian calculations, the assumption is made that other worlds would be like ours and use similar technologies.

It’s a fair point. I know too little about mindmatters.ai to provide an alternative explanation for their use of column space for this topic.

It’s a fair point. I know too little about mindmatters.ai to provide an alternative explanation for their use of column space for this topic.

They are definitely anti-materialist, and I believe just about everyone involved in the site is religious if not explicitly some denomination of Christianity.

They might all be American as well, given some of their political stuff.

All that said, as someone who posts Catholic Scholastics and Occultist Anarchists and everyone beyond & in-between, they do have quality stuff relating to the mind-body question.

In two recent articles they make the same argument as I have made about the improbability of anything extrasolar flying around here:

https://mindmatters.ai/2024/06/interstel...r-destiny/

I have seen suggestions that UFOs might be craft that were spread across the galaxy billions of years ago (so great speed was not an issue) and one or more of these lurk in remote parts of the solar system.

I'm not keen on the idea, but it does exist.

However, there does seem to be a fair amount of evidence for a physical reality and also evidence that UFOs can mess with people's consciousness.

For some reason I'm not super interested in UFOs, but I don't think these phenomena can be easily dismissed.

David

However, there does seem to be a fair amount of evidence for a physical reality

The "evidence" usually gets debunked and then the debunking gets predictably hand-waved away by die-hard proponents.

The "evidence" usually gets debunked and then the debunking gets predictably hand-waved away by die-hard proponents.

Come on Brian, you can't combine views like that with being a Christian!

David

These articles tell me that the Discovery Institute, which I believe is a relatively unknown institution in Europe, is a curious thing. They clearly adhere largely to the scientific methodology in their arguments. What sets them apart from the mainstream seems mainly to be their questions about the origin of life and the evolution of life. There’s much to like about them, as I think they are great at calling out unjustified extrapolations of mainstream science and insisting that atheism doesn’t need to be a hidden prior assumption in scientific discovery. Labeling everything they do as “pseudoscience” seems very unfair to me; they do science a great favor by asking all those skeptical questions.

That is music to my ears, although I want to emphasis that I am not a Christian of any variant!

David