Neuroscience and free will

Physical axioms don't need to exist in every possible world. ["Change being actualizing of that which is potential, requiring something already actual" is true in all worlds from Hogwarts to the Marvel Cinematic Universe.]

I don't understand why other worlds matter, though I agree there could be worlds with no physical axioms.

Sorry, what is this question again? Maybe you can rephrase it rather than just using the word "how" because I still don't really understand what it is you want. You say a "script" - do you mean something like an algorithm or equation? Because then it would obviously no longer be free.

Why did I choose chicken rather than fish? That is, the question you asked a few pages ago.

And if I say it's a fundamental force, that would just not be a real explanation for you correct? Though I suspect most people would, upon seeing a demonstration of definitive macro-PK, be convinced of mental causation as "Mind over Matter". [Personally I like the Unity of Will & Force...]

That would be a statement of the fact that the force is axiomatic. It would not explain how the force operates. We can do that with the four physical forces.

Spin wouldn't be at the bottom since it would have to be explained [why] the property either stays the same or changes. [And I don't know what "layers" are needed?]

So there is nothing to explain between the force and a particular result of the force?

True randomness would defy any probability distribution. It would be Meillassoux's "Hyperchaos" when particles could change into dragons...or the Real could be as predictable as clockwork forever. [There's a thread on it here.]

Some randomness has a uniform probability distribution. Some does not. I do not know why this is the case.

~~ Paul

I'm just looking for a hand-waving description of a deterministic decision. Can nobody give me a hand-waving description of a deterministic decision? Just a single step would be fine. A necessary step. A necessitating step. Oh me, oh my, but where can I find my hand-waving description of a deterministic decision? How am I to accept the possibility of a deterministic decision without even a basic, hand-waving description? Alas, alas. Please, somebody. Put me out of my misery.

I gave you a 3-step hand-waving description up above.

The funny thing is, if you use my inability to be more specific as an excuse not to try at all, why would I jump on the bandwagon?

~~ Paul

[Laird]

I gave you a 3-step hand-waving description up above.

Please, can anybody give me a hand-waving description of a deterministic decision? Just a few necessary steps. Somebody, give me an example of a deterministic decision with some necessary steps. Please, somebody - anybody - fulfill my sincere request. All I'm asking for is even a vague example of a necessary series of steps which constitute a deterministic decision. Seriously, can nobody provide this?

Please, can anybody give me a hand-waving description of a deterministic decision? Just a few necessary steps. Somebody, give me an example of a deterministic decision with some necessary steps. Please, somebody - anybody - fulfill my sincere request. All I'm asking for is even a vague example of a necessary series of steps which constitute a deterministic decision. Seriously, can nobody provide this?

Just assume they are necessary. It may be that there are no necessary events in our world, but I can still describe a set of necessary steps just in case our world is deterministic/random. I have a way of answering my own question in the context of such a world.

If you are going to insist that there are no necessary steps in our world, then that only increases the burden on you to describe how an unnecessary step actually occurs. But this is all irrelevant, since I have already stipulated that there is room for free will. I asked for a description of how a free decision is made. In response, you asked me for an example of a description in a physicalist world. I gave you one. The entire point of the description is to show what I want, not to be guaranteed correct. In particular, it does not involve any underlying axioms. I'm not asking for your axioms. I'm asking for something like I presented.

If it's not possible to give such a description without sounding mechanistic, fine. If you believe my question is incoherent, then I will accept that. But it will be tough to accept an alternate model of reality when the fundamental point in question---we can make free decisions---is just a matter of faith.

~~ Paul

[Laird]

Just assume they are necessary.

I'm still looking for an example of a deterministic decision, folks. Anybody? Even just a hand-waving description, even just a single step that is necessary. I'm willing to assume it's possible, but I still need a definitive example. Even of just one necessary step. Anybody? All I need is a single step. Just one step - one necessary step. Honestly, I'm willing to set aside my preconceptions and assume that it's possible - but I need an example. Seriously, can nobody give me that example?

I'm still looking for an example of a deterministic decision, folks. Anybody? Even just a hand-waving description, even just a single step that is necessary. I'm willing to assume it's possible, but I still need a definitive example. Even of just one necessary step. Anybody? All I need is a single step. Just one step - one necessary step. Honestly, I'm willing to set aside my preconceptions and assume that it's possible - but I need an example. Seriously, can nobody give me that example?

Are you claiming that there is no possible world in which some events happen out of necessity?

~~ Paul

[Laird]

Are you claiming that there is no possible world in which some events happen out of necessity?

Still looking for that example, guys. Strange that nobody can provide it. All it takes is a single step. Just one necessary step! Come on, surely that's not too much to ask?! Just an example of a necessitated decision - doesn't have to be a complete example, even a small part of it that's necessitated. Surely somebody can come up with an example. I'm suspending my judgement, after all. It's not too much to ask.

Still looking for that example, guys. Strange that nobody can provide it. All it  takes is a single step. Just one necessary step! Come on, surely that's not too much to ask?! Just an example of a necessitated decision - doesn't have to be a complete example, even a small part of it that's necessitated. Surely somebody can come up with an example. I'm suspending my judgement, after all. It's not too much to ask.

I gave you examples of deterministic/random decisions in the context of a world where there are such things. I agree that there are no such decisions in the context of a world that is not deterministic/random.

I hereby retract my example.

Are you claiming that there is no possible world in which some events occur out of necessity?

~~ Paul

[Laird]

I hereby retract my example.

Still looking for an example of a necessitated decision, guys. I'm open-minded. I accept that possibility that I'm a stone-crazy fool who doesn't really make decisions, and that something (but what?!) or somebody (but who?!) is necessitating the decisions I (delusionally) believe that I make, but I'm going to need even just a hand-waving example of a decision that's necessitated to really buy into this idea. Anybody?

Still looking for an example of a necessitated decision, guys. I'm open-minded. I accept that possibility that I'm a stone-crazy fool who doesn't really make decisions, and that something (but what?!) or somebody (but who?!) is necessitating the decisions I (delusionally) believe that I make, but I'm going to need even just a hand-waving example of a decision that's necessitated to really buy into this idea.  Anybody?

Are you claiming that there is no possible world in which some events occur out of necessity?

~~ Paul