James Randi crosses over

I come at this from a predictable standpoint and I do think he behaved badly (in sum) but I don't know everything about him (he surely had some redeeming aspects to him). 

NDE's were dismissed along with everything else, thereby convincing a great many people that there's nothing going on, death is the end and that's it. Grow up, face it and stop being irrational etc, which always received/receives a round of applause from the gallery. But he didn't deal with the evidence honestly.

Doctors, Surgeons and medical personnel with something to say to the contrary were ignored or 'poo poohed'. The never ending refutation of patients (ordinary sane men and women of good judgement with no agenda) adamant that they had seen things they couldn't possibly have seen when completely unconscious, often even when their brain function was zero. Nope, you're all mistaken, trust me there's always an explanation, move along, folks !  

That's what I really despise. That arrogant dishonesty and the determination to pursue it no matter what (like Woerlee). In my opinion, he was effectively trying to rob people of part of their birthright for no good reason.  Everyone will have their own opinion, of course.

As I recall he destroyed the career of a scientist simply for suggesting there was something to homeopathy, I'd have to look up the details.

Randi seemed happy to enable a fraud commit ID theft while ruining the careers of those who simply disagreed with his atheistic/materialistic fundamentalism.

Perhaps the host of Skeptoid was inspired by Randi & his assistant, as that atheist fundie also committed fraud against unsuspecting innocents.

[Ninshub]

So when someone like Randi crosses over, the traditional spiritualist thinking is they might not be aware that they're "dead". But in case of someone who at least is cursorily aware of NDEs, etc., do you think he has a clue of what's happening?  

Or is his higher self feeling great and being congratulated right "now" on having played his role so well, fulfilling whatever purposes it had?

I'm opting for a little of B and C.

As I recall he destroyed the career of a scientist simply for suggesting there was something to homeopathy, I'd have to look up the details.

Wasn't that Brian Josephson? 

Also, do we know whether or not Randi himself knew about the ongoing ID theft?

Wasn't that Brian Josephson? 

Also, do we know whether or not Randi himself knew about the ongoing ID theft?

No - it wasn't Josephson.

As to whether he knew he is either an enabler and co-participant of fraud or was just incapable of detecting fraud when it was happening closest to him.

Both are good reasons for doubting any debunking he worked on.

As such I'm genuinely curious what was "especially good" about anything Randi worked on - there can be diamonds in the rough but I think we'd need to get specific examples of that.

Peter Popoff for example.  Psychic surgery for example.

Peter Popoff for example.  Psychic surgery for example.

Any links?

So when someone like Randi crosses over, the traditional spiritualist thinking is they might not be aware that they're "dead". But in case of someone who at least is cursorily aware of NDEs, etc., do you think he has a clue of what's happening?  

Or is his higher self feeling great and being congratulated right "now" on having played his role so well, fulfilling whatever purposes it had?

I'm opting for a little of B and C.

I have to admit that I would wish him a bit of embarrassment. I suspect it probably doesn't work like that, though. Or maybe it does ? (Life review)

I have to admit that I would wish him a bit of embarrassment. I suspect it probably doesn't work like that, though. Or maybe it does ? (Life review)

We all have ideas about how we’d like to see those that did stupid or ‘evil’ things here on earth, my ego would surely enjoy seeing Randi grovel a bit ! 

Who knows what the truth may be? It’s interesting reading Jurgen Ziewe’s book, where he describes seeing a terrorist who committed suicide, killing others in the process. The guy definitely didn’t appear to be in a good place! Jurgen also describes meeting his dead mother, and at first she was in a sort of cocoon of depression, hard to reach. Eventually he says she worked her way out of that state, and into a much happier one, where they were able to communicate once more. 

By the way Tim. I wanted to say thanks for having faith in the mystery of NDEs. I have found solace and peace returning to the threads, watching and reading them in the past few months. 

Here is an excerpt from Ziewe’s book ‘Vistas of Infinity’ in which he describes the situation of the suicide bomber I mentioned in post #18 of this thread. 

“With the next powerful thunderbolt I began to regret my decision of having come here, but curiosity made me urge myself further into the region until I finally discovered that the evil billowing smoke came from piles of slowly burning human bodies who were wriggling in agony. In the very first pile I encountered, these twisting, charred and convulsing bodies were stretching their hands and clamouring towards a person who was trapped right in the centre of the pile, who himself reached towards the bleak sky, desperately praying for help. The person was surrounded by the very real thought forms of his victims and the representation of their pain. However hard he pleaded, his voice never reached past the heavy curtain of smoke that shielded and surrounded him like an impregnable bastion. I quickly noticed that this impenetrable layer was made of regret and the realisation that the fate of his victims and their suffering could never ever be reversed or erased. It was a wall of absolute impossibility built from his victims’ pain and unbearable suffering and the overbearing realisation that this was a deed that could never be undone.”

Is this a self imposed state? 

We all have ideas about how we’d like to see those that did stupid or ‘evil’ things here on earth, my ego would surely enjoy seeing Randi grovel a bit ! 

Who knows what the truth may be? It’s interesting reading Jurgen Ziewe’s book, where he describes seeing a terrorist who committed suicide, killing others in the process. The guy definitely didn’t appear to be in a good place! Jurgen also describes meeting his dead mother, and at first she was in a sort of cocoon of depression, hard to reach. Eventually he says she worked her way out of that state, and into a much happier one, where they were able to communicate once more. 

By the way Tim. I wanted to say thanks for having faith in the mystery of NDEs. I have found solace and peace returning to the threads, watching and reading them in the past few months. 

We all have ideas about how we’d like to see those that did stupid or ‘evil’ things here on earth, my ego would surely enjoy seeing Randi grovel a bit ! 

Yes, one can't help feeling that way, we're not saints. If he'd addressed the evidence fairly and acknowledged that there is indeed a mystery here, then that would have been alright for me. I don't need anyone to 'believe' that NDE's are "proof" of an afterlife, only that they accept the facts and make up their own minds. 

Stan, I'm really glad that you and others like them ! No need to thank me but thanks anyway for saying it. It doesn't go unnoticed when I get a "like" from anyone. I never expect any, I just hope that what I can find is acceptable and interesting for the members etc.  

As to 'faith' in the mystery, I would say it's not faith, it's purely evidence. It is fair to say that they're a mystery, though because there is no scientific explanation for them. A great many scientists (as you know) like to pretend that there is...somewhere in the over twenty hypotheses that have been proposed. You know the kind of thing; it must be in there somewhere (in the 20)..that must have it covered. 

Actually we're no nearer to a scientific explanation than we were 40 years ago. The only explanation that actually fits the data and works, is the only one that they will not even consider.