Is physical mediumship fraudulent?

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(2017-09-13, 06:56 PM)Brian Wrote: Re apports.  Is it claimed that the spirits produce these or is it a talent of the medium?  I'm trying to understand who has this miraculous power to produce items out of thin air.  It all seems so far fetched to me and smacks of conjuring.

It is your belief that apportation is miraculous, it certainly is not mine.

The apportation process stems from the abilities of those in what we term 'the spirit world' (multi-dimensional planes of existence). They have the ability to copy the ethereal form of the object then using that template recreate the apport (not move it - typically) in its desired location. In 'the spirit world' this is a natural capability among many more natural abilities they have including managing the physical mediumship demonstration.

This is the problem of the individual who cannot wrap their heads around the fact that judging capabilities using this earth-life as a basis for doing so is a fundamentally and operationally flawed approach. Hence 'miracles'.
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(2017-09-13, 07:44 PM)tim Wrote: ...I wouldn't have believed anything like that could happen until I'd personally witnessed a couple of really strange events (not during mediumship but still basically similar in bizarreness). If I'm honest, I still doubt my own experience now. I think I would have preferred what happened to me, not to have happened  because I don't have an explanation and it's unnerving. I know it's of no value to anyone else though.

'Unnerved' = fear. What are you afraid of? That you have a belief that isn't true but that you are afraid to confront?

Good. Fear is your friend. An absolute sign that you are not aligned who you really are. It's your Higher Mind's way of saying "Look, over here, look at this belief, were did it come from, does it make sense?"  Examination time!
(2017-09-13, 07:44 PM)tim Wrote: I share your scepticism on this. I wouldn't have believed anything like that could happen until I'd personally witnessed a couple of really strange events (not during mediumship but still basically similar in bizarreness). If I'm honest, I still doubt my own experience now. I think I would have preferred what happened to me, not to have happened  because I don't have an explanation and it's unnerving. I know it's of no value to anyone else though.

I would love to hear more. But sensing you are wanting to keep it private...
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(2017-09-13, 06:56 PM)Brian Wrote: Re apports.  Is it claimed that the spirits produce these or is it a talent of the medium?  I'm trying to understand who has this miraculous power to produce items out of thin air.  It all seems so far fetched to me and smacks of conjuring.

Generally speaking it is the purported communicators who are said to produce the apport but they sometimes say that they make use of the medium to make it happen. I guess there are several ways this might be explained (assuming it can be done). One explanation apparently is that the object is dematerialised somehow, transported in the immaterial state and then rematerialsed in the seance. The other is that the wall or other obstacles are partially demarialised or altered in some way to allow the object to pass.

I have to confess I am puzzled as to what role the medium plays (unless the find someone near the object who unknowingly has what they need) in the dematerialisation of what are, sometimes, supposedly very distant objects.

There does seem to be quite a bit of well-attested testimony that it is possible. Without experiencing it for oneself I guess, or at least knowing someone who has, it seems hard to form a definitive view.
(This post was last modified: 2017-09-13, 09:50 PM by Obiwan.)
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(2017-09-13, 08:11 PM)Pssst Wrote: It is your belief that apportation is miraculous, it certainly is not mine.

The apportation process stems from the abilities of those in what we term 'the spirit world' (multi-dimensional planes of existence). They have the ability to copy the ethereal form of the object then using that template recreate the apport (not move it - typically) in its desired location. In 'the spirit world' this is a natural capability among many more natural abilities they have including managing the physical mediumship demonstration.

This is the problem of the individual who cannot wrap their heads around the fact that judging capabilities using this earth-life as a basis for doing so is a fundamentally and operationally flawed approach. Hence 'miracles'.

What safeguards can the medium take to avoid injury (or worse!)? How are they able to ensure they don't apport a vehicle or a building?
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Or an overly aggressive forum moderator, or a friendly looking floppy eared dog, or a tub of margarine?
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Sorry, failed attempt to apport FDRS.
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(2017-09-13, 08:42 PM)jkmac Wrote: I would love to hear more. But sensing you are wanting to keep it private...

Maybe I shouldn't have said anything, jkmac. What happened, can't happen but it did happen. But as I've said, it's of no use
to anyone else.
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(2017-09-13, 08:15 PM)Pssst Wrote: 'Unnerved' = fear. What are you afraid of? That you have a belief that isn't true but that you are afraid to confront?

Good. Fear is your friend. An absolute sign that you are not aligned who you really are. It's your Higher Mind's way of saying "Look, over here, look at this belief, were did it come from, does it make sense?"  Examination time!

What are you afraid of ?

It's not that. I just wanted an explanation and there wasn't one.
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