Have We Already Been Visited by Aliens?

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Have We Already Been Visited by Aliens?

Elizabeth Kolbert


Quote:An eminent astrophysicist argues that signs of intelligent extraterrestrial life have appeared in our skies. What’s the evidence for his extraordinary claim?



Quote:Far from being deterred, Loeb doubled down. Together with Thiem Hoang, a researcher at the Korea Astronomy and Space Science Institute, he blasted the frozen-hydrogen theory. In another equation-packed paper, the pair argued that it was fantastical to imagine solid hydrogen floating around outer space. And, if a frozen chunk did manage to take shape, there was no way for a block the size of ‘Oumuamua to survive an interstellar journey. “Assuming that H2 objects could somehow form,” Hoang and Loeb wrote, “sublimation by collisional heating” would vaporize them before they had the chance to, in a manner of speaking, take off.

Loeb has now dispensed with the scientific notation and written “Extraterrestrial: The First Sign of Intelligent Life Beyond Earth” (Houghton Mifflin Harcourt). In it, he recounts the oft-told story of how Galileo was charged with heresy for asserting that Earth circled the sun. At his trial in Rome, in 1633, Galileo recanted and then, legend has it, muttered, sotto voce, “Eppur si muove” (“And yet it moves”). Loeb acknowledges that the quote is probably apocryphal; still, he maintains, it’s relevant. The astronomical establishment may wish to silence him, but it can’t explain why ‘Oumuamua strayed from the expected path. “And yet it deviated,” he observes.

In “Extraterrestrial,” Loeb lays out his reasoning as follows. The only way to make sense of ‘Oumuamua’s strange acceleration, without resorting to some sort of undetectable outgassing, is to assume that the object was propelled by solar radiation—essentially, photons bouncing off its surface. And the only way the object could be propelled by solar radiation is if it were extremely thin—no thicker than a millimetre—with a very low density and a comparatively large surface area. Such an object would function as a sail—one powered by light, rather than by wind. The natural world doesn’t produce sails; people do. Thus, Loeb writes, “ ‘Oumuamua must have been designed, built, and launched by an extraterrestrial intelligence.”
'Historically, we may regard materialism as a system of dogma set up to combat orthodox dogma...Accordingly we find that, as ancient orthodoxies disintegrate, materialism more and more gives way to scepticism.'

- Bertrand Russell


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I think that on one level the evidence is overwhelming that the answer is yes, but many others would say definitely no. I’m not in either group. 

I tend to favour the answer ‘yes’, so I would have to say that I’m technically in the ‘don’t know for sure’, group. 

I think this sort of nuance is often overlooked, to our detriment. There are plenty nuances that I’ve still to learn, before anyone comments.  Tongue
Oh my God, I hate all this.   Surprise
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One of the trapped miners (Dave Fellin) in the Shepton mine collapse related that Aliens had visited the earth, If my memory serves me well. I think he stated that they had actually started human life on earth (Fellin claimed to have travelled back in time whilst he was having out of body experiences in the enclosed "hole" he and his friend were trapped in.

Of course, it's of no scientific value whatsoever. Strange thing for a coal miner to come up with, though.
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(2021-01-26, 02:06 PM)tim Wrote: One of the trapped miners (Dave Fellin) in the Shepton mine collapse related that Aliens had visited the earth, If my memory serves me well. I think he stated that they had actually started human life on earth (Fellin claimed to have travelled back in time whilst he was having out of body experiences in the enclosed "hole" he and his friend were trapped in.

Of course, it's of no scientific value whatsoever. Strange thing for a coal miner to come up with, though.

Somebody is sure to come up with hallucinations caused by sensory deprivation, so I'll play devils advocate and get there first. Tongue
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(2021-01-26, 07:40 PM)Brian Wrote: Somebody is sure to come up with hallucinations caused by sensory deprivation, so I'll play devils advocate and get there first. Tongue

Thing is they both saw the same things much of the time. It was David Fellin who claimed he'd travelled to other planets in his out of body state. One has to reject such statements, of course. But it seems unlikely given the endless vastness of the universe that we are the only habitable planet. 

Could some necessary ingredients/aspects of life have been planted here by more advanced beings. I don't find it very plausible myself but I'm willing to be open minded about it, just about, that is.
(This post was last modified: 2021-01-26, 09:50 PM by tim.)
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(2021-01-26, 09:49 PM)tim Wrote: Thing is they both saw the same things much of the time. It was David Fellin who claimed he'd travelled to other planets in his out of body state. One has to reject such statements, of course.

Is there any particular reason one has to reject the statements? Or is it just a matter of attempting not to appear foolish/gullible by saying anything else?
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(2021-01-26, 09:49 PM)tim Wrote: Thing is they both saw the same things much of the time. It was David Fellin who claimed he'd travelled to other planets in his out of body state. One has to reject such statements, of course. But it seems unlikely given the endless vastness of the universe that we are the only habitable planet. 

Could some necessary ingredients/aspects of life have been planted here by more advanced beings. I don't find it very plausible myself but I'm willing to be open minded about it, just about, that is.

I think we stand in the same place on this one.
(2021-01-28, 04:28 PM)Typoz Wrote: Is there any particular reason one has to reject the statements? Or is it just a matter of attempting not to appear foolish/gullible by saying anything else?

The problem is that without evidence to support it impossible to verify but an easy claim to make isn’t it (I realise you see this lol). Personally I’d shrug my shoulder and say “dunno”.
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(2021-01-28, 04:28 PM)Typoz Wrote: Is there any particular reason one has to reject the statements? Or is it just a matter of attempting not to appear foolish/gullible by saying anything else?

I suppose the obvious reason is that without some evidence or some way to validate what is being claimed, one can make any claim about 'Lord knows what'. It's unfalsifiable so of no scientific value, or so the current paradigm insists. 

Do I think that David Fellin had out of body experiences in the mine. I do. Do I believe he travelled back in time to see the Pyramids being constructed (he stated that the large stones were created from poured concrete (the small stones of the desert with sand and lime etc) into wooden sets, not hauled from miles away) ?

What intrigues me is how a coal miner would even come up with a tale like that. Interestingly, there is a notable (not for being nuts) French geologist who also thinks that the Pyramid stones were poured like concrete rather than cut from rock and dragged for miles.
(This post was last modified: 2021-01-29, 04:02 PM by tim.)
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(2021-01-29, 04:01 PM)tim Wrote: I suppose the obvious reason is that without some evidence or some way to validate what is being claimed, one can make any claim about 'Lord knows what'. It's unfalsifiable so of no scientific value, or so the current paradigm insists. 

Do I think that David Fellin had out of body experiences in the mine. I do. Do I believe he travelled back in time to see the Pyramids being constructed (he stated that the large stones were created from poured concrete (the small stones of the desert with sand and lime etc) into wooden sets, not hauled from miles away) ?

What intrigues me is how a coal miner would even come up with a tale like that. Interestingly, there is a notable (not for being nuts) French geologist who also thinks that the Pyramid stones were poured like concrete rather than cut from rock and dragged for miles.

I suppose if someone has had a particular idea - such as the 'poured like concrete', then someone else might tune into that idea - regardless of whether or not it is in itself valid. That's one possibility, though not the only one.

On the 'visiting planets' part of the thing, well there's lots of stuff that people say happened during an NDE. Only a small portion of it is even able to be verified. In those situations we just have to make of it what we will. Not necessarily swallow it whole, but not necessarily throw it out either. There is some middle ground where all we can do is listen, if we feel like it, and for me personally, throw it in the pot with everything else I've heard. Somewhere in that potful of ideas I gain my own outline of the shape of the world we may be living in. There's certainly a lot which I don't value very highly, but a fair amount which I just treat with a sense of curiosity, some things do attract my attention and give me something to think about, even when they are very far from the ordinary.
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