(2017-08-22, 03:16 AM)Sciborg_S_Patel Wrote: [ -> ]On CT and fringe politics...You're basically asking to make Psience Quest Alex's trash bin. He makes a bunch of podcasts about conspiracies, but when the "Jews did it" ppl show up someone can just say, "Oh sorry that's not really Skeptiko's thing, just go over to this other fourm..."
This isn't to say Alex has some nefarious intention, rather that this would just be natural situation.
I was thinking something similar, if Alex starts to dig his heels in and reject topics he doesn't like, it might seem natural for the next destination to be here. But this place too has a view of what sort of content is core. As Alex says, there's a big internet out there, this isn't the only discussion forum in existence.
(2017-08-22, 03:43 AM)Laird Wrote: [ -> ]Please speak up within five days if you disagree with this proposal in general, knowing that we can discuss later as to the names and placement of these new subforums, and the name(s) of any new group(s), as well as whether there should be one group for both forums, or one for each forum.
I'm really sorry to appear obstinate on this (and I'm speaking for myself only) but I would have to say that I'm against it. My feeling is that Skeptiko lost its focus from the time that Alex started pushing subjects like atheists being secret satanists and other crazy conspiracies. The political threads also became dominant - probably naturally as a consequence of Trump and Brexit coming to the fore but a lot of bad feeling was generated and people left because of it. I thought it would be back to business as usual after the elections but it wasn't. Now Skeptiko is all but dead to many of us who saw it as a haven for interesting and open discussion about parapsychology.
Having a splinter group for CT and Politics (those two will inevitably blend together) will split and dilute the focus of the forum. People will be curious as to what is happening in those private sub-forums and will join. Others will come along with little or no interest in the original topics while potential newbies might be put off if people keep referring to subjects being discussed in private groups.
(2017-08-22, 01:36 AM)chuck Wrote: [ -> ]What about the historical Jesus vs. the Roman influence on the bible? Is that subject allowed? Or no because it was already contentious at Skeptiko?
It's boring AF...
Especially after Alex shoved it down our throats for 1+ year. I vote "no" on it, and on any CT that is not directly related to consciousness (UFO, government experiments are a notable exception as mentioned in the first page of this thread).
Just an addendum to my previous post: I am not saying that I have no interest in those subjects. I too posted often in the Trump and Brexit threads. I am also quite interested in JFK and 911 though my tolerance for speculative CTs is pretty low. I just don't think that, given the chance to make a new start with our core interest, we should already be diversifying into subjects more than adequately catered for elsewhere.
I haven't kept up with this thread, but Kamarling makes a good argument here and I'll say I'm in agreement with him, and therefore in disagreement with the proposal put forward.
Re: Roman bible, historical Jesus. I don't think that qualifies as "CT" (?) necessarily (especially the latter), and would have no problem with that in Other Stuff.
(2017-08-22, 02:41 AM)malf Wrote: [ -> ]Can we moderate topics because they're dull?
Didn't notice that comment before. It seems we have a consensus here... The topic stinks and surely the "new" Skeptiko will have it covered for the foreseeable future.
(2017-08-22, 03:43 AM)Laird Wrote: [ -> ]OK... let's try this second compromise-consensus. Same deal as before - anybody who disagrees, speak up within five days, in which case we really will have to go to a vote. Otherwise, let's go with this compromise.
- Two new subforums are set up, named something like "Politics" and "Conspiracy Theories".
- These two subforums are only visible to members in a newly created usergroup(s).
- Likewise, the posts within these two subforums are only visible in lists like "View New Posts", "View Today's Posts" and "View Unread Posts" to members in the new usergroup(s).
- (If possible, which I think it is) Members can freely add themselves to and remove themselves from the usergroup(s) i.e. on their own, without moderator intervention.
Please speak up within five days if you disagree with this proposal in general, knowing that we can discuss later as to the names and placement of these new subforums, and the name(s) of any new group(s), as well as whether there should be one group for both forums, or one for each forum.
I would suggest some kind of outside-of-this-thread alert be made available, maybe as another thread directing people to this one, for all those who won't be following this thread and seeing this post.
(2017-08-22, 04:11 AM)Kamarling Wrote: [ -> ]I'm really sorry to appear obstinate on this (and I'm speaking for myself only) but I would have to say that I'm against it. My feeling is that Skeptiko lost its focus from the time that Alex started pushing subjects like atheists being secret satanists and other crazy conspiracies. The political threads also became dominant - probably naturally as a consequence of Trump and Brexit coming to the fore but a lot of bad feeling was generated and people left because of it. I thought it would be back to business as usual after the elections but it wasn't. Now Skeptiko is all but dead to many of us who saw it as a haven for interesting and open discussion about parapsychology.
Having a splinter group for CT and Politics (those two will inevitably blend together) will split and dilute the focus of the forum. People will be curious as to what is happening in those private sub-forums and will join. Others will come along with little or no interest in the original topics while potential newbies might be put off if people keep referring to subjects being discussed in private groups.
We not only risk losing our focus, but also the possibility that confrontations that take place within the hidden groups leak out to the core. Take the Brian/Dante situation (sorry guys, just using it as an example) that began at Skeptiko and found its way here. I say that as long as Skeptiko is pushing CTs and places like Infowars have forums, it's kinda redundant.
(2017-08-22, 04:11 AM)Kamarling Wrote: [ -> ]I'm really sorry to appear obstinate on this (and I'm speaking for myself only) but I would have to say that I'm against it. My feeling is that Skeptiko lost its focus from the time that Alex started pushing subjects like atheists being secret satanists and other crazy conspiracies. The political threads also became dominant - probably naturally as a consequence of Trump and Brexit coming to the fore but a lot of bad feeling was generated and people left because of it. I thought it would be back to business as usual after the elections but it wasn't. Now Skeptiko is all but dead to many of us who saw it as a haven for interesting and open discussion about parapsychology.
Having a splinter group for CT and Politics (those two will inevitably blend together) will split and dilute the focus of the forum. People will be curious as to what is happening in those private sub-forums and will join. Others will come along with little or no interest in the original topics while potential newbies might be put off if people keep referring to subjects being discussed in private groups.
I think this is well put. While I understand that CT and politics have their place, and their relationships to the metaphysical, I personally would love to see the forum be almost exclusively about paranormal and metaphysical stuff, research and the like. I don't want to push that too hard, because I also understand that there are lots of people who like to discuss those things
along with their relationships to the aforementioned phenomena. However, I have the same fear as others here that it could "devolve" ultimately into political discussion, especially in times when paranormal discussion may be stale or slow. There's always something going on that allows people to talk about politics, and they're just inflammatory enough to garner a lot of attention. Same goes for CT. Again, they have a place, and I get that. I suppose after typing all this out I'm really a bit torn about what is best.
(2017-08-22, 04:42 AM)Dante Wrote: [ -> ]... Same goes for CT. Again, they have a place, and I get that. I suppose after typing all this out I'm really a bit torn about what is best.
I know what you mean. Sometimes those subjects are really interesting. I went through a phase in the 90's when I was into ancient civilisations, alternative archaeology, sacred geometry and half a dozen related subjects. I joined a couple of forums at the time and eventually satisfied my interest and moved on. The point being that I joined forums dedicated to those subjects.
Now, if anyone cares to look back a few pages, I said to Chuck that I have no problem discussing all manner of subjects which overlap with our core focus. The CIA psi program was the example under discussion and doubtless there are many other examples. Similarly with religion: there is bound to be an overlap but I don't think we should have a sub-forum to discuss religion, especially when it slides into fundamentalist topics such as God and his angels being at war with Satan.
Simply put: I don't support a ban on CTs, etc., being discussed but I do think we should encourage members to use some common sense, observe the context and not derail thread for the sake of some pet theory or for proselytising a particular religious view. Just as we wouldn't expect our atheist members to bombard us with anti-religious links and videos.