Near-death experience of physician Bettina Peyton

Hi, Ian. I found her presentation to be overtly dramatised, sentimental, too emotional for my liking without trying to be disrespectful to her. She could have focussed more on the veridical nature of her NDE which is the only 'measurable' part which science would pay any attention to. Others will disagree (Stan probably will if he's in the mood  

May I ask what you think or anyone else ?

These traits  (......overtly dramatised, sentimental, too emotional) irritate the hell out of me; I find them to be common in women's accounts of NDE's. PMH  Atwater is an undisputed queen of this over-dramatization, almost hysterical emotionality and, at the same time, little substance.

These traits  (......overtly dramatised, sentimental, too emotional) irritate the hell out of me; I find them to be common in women's accounts of NDE's. PMH  Atwater is an undisputed queen of this over-dramatization, almost hysterical emotionality and, at the same time, little substance.

I agree, Enrique ! And they're giving hard line sceptics ammunition at the same time.

[Laird]

It might have been a little over-done, but the experience that she shared seems to have been a profound one for her, so I don't think it was such a bad idea for her to have tried to convey that to her audience in the way that she did.

In any case, I don't think that giving air to the "hysterical, over-emotional women" trope is helpful, because of the damage it has done over time, and because we currently have no active female forum members, and are not likely to draw them by perpetuating it.

It might have been a little over-done, but the experience that she shared seems to have been a profound one for her, so I don't think it was such a bad idea for her to have tried to convey that to her audience in the way that she did.

In any case, I don't think that giving air to the "hysterical, over-emotional women" trope is helpful, because of the damage it has done over time, and because we currently have no active female forum members, and are not likely to draw them by perpetuating it.

Personally, I don't like social engineering (representative percentages), Laird. Of course I'm not suggesting you do but it wouldn't bother me if the whole forum was just women, or just men or composed of all black or all white etc etc. It is what it is. 

As to the trope, I don't think women are more prone to be hysterical than men. But in relating NDE's, maybe they open up more with their emotions. The point I was making (really) is that IANDS needs to be careful, as emotion and science don't mix well and if they want to continue to be taken seriously, it might be wise to advise speakers to remain more sober, if that is the right word.

[Ninshub]

May I ask what you think or anyone else ?

I haven't listened to it.

Happy holidays to you and everyone. Hope you all stay well.

I'd say the issue is less with women and more with IANDS.

OTOH they do need to get their funding from somewhere, and the emotional stuff gets more put on the collection plate...

edit: To be a little less cynical, if I was conditioned to be a Materialist/Atheist and my faith in that atheistic sort of religion was absolutely shattered I'd probably be emotional too...

I haven't listened to it.

Happy holidays to you and everyone. Hope you all stay well.

Thanks, Ian. And the same to you !

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Personally, I don't like social engineering (representative percentages), Laird. Of course I'm not suggesting you do but it wouldn't bother me if the whole forum was just women, or just men or composed of all black or all white etc etc. It is what it is. 

As to the trope, I don't think women are more prone to be hysterical than men. But in relating NDE's, maybe they open up more with their emotions. The point I was making (really) is that IANDS needs to be careful, as emotion and science don't mix well and if they want to continue to be taken seriously, it might be wise to advise speakers to remain more sober, if that is the right word.

Agreed 100%

I'd say the issue is less with women and more with IANDS.

OTOH they do need to get their funding from somewhere, and the emotional stuff gets more put on the collection plate...

edit: To be a little less cynical, if I was conditioned to be a Materialist/Atheist and my faith in that atheistic sort of religion was absolutely shattered I'd probably be emotional too...

Guess so, Sci. I wanted her to address the veridical elements of her NDE. I would have liked to have heard what the white haired senior resident (?) surgeon who put his hand into her abdomen had to say about it (for instance) and how it's affected his views on this matter (the mind/brain debate)  and maybe some of the other medical personal that witnessed this emergency. How can they explain her observations and as they obviously can't, what have they got to say, if anything...

Guess so, Sci. I wanted her to address the veridical elements of her NDE. I would have liked to have heard what the white haired senior resident (?) surgeon who put his hand into her abdomen had to say about it (for instance) and how it's affected his views on this matter (the mind/brain debate)  and maybe some of the other medical personal that witnessed this emergency. How can they explain her observations and as they obviously can't, what have they got to say, if anything...

Agreed on all points, but I think IANDS has been going in this direction for awhile?

There was that whole Eckankar issue around 2016 that AFAIK didn't get resolved so much as faded into the background.