In July 2014, Joe Hirl was driven to hospital by his wife suffering from an acute heart attack. As he was received by emergency room Doctor Harold Moores and his team, Hirl's heart completely stopped and the medics spent a record (for them) 57 minutes trying to bring him back, eventually succeeding.
It's interesting to note the different protocols in
different States (of America) ten minutes here (Michigan) and they (usually) stop according to Moores.
“He technically was dead,” Dr. Moores said. “Here we are 13 minutes into it. The standard for CPR is you go 10 minutes, then you’re done. We kept trying because he kept trying. He would get a sustained rhythm with a pulse, then we would lose it. He kept trying to live.”
https://healthbeat.spectrumhealth.org/he...k-to-life/
The same doctor Moores is briefly interviewed (2.24) in this magazine (slightly sentimental) style news report which focusses on the NDE's of two women, mainly Mary Robling.
Dr Moores mentions an out of body experience (reported by a man during resuscitation) and an encounter with his deceased mother which is similarly reported above. Maybe it's the same guy, maybe not.
https://www.9and10news.com/2018/11/14/sp...om-heaven/
Guy Chanet part 2 - THE SECOND EXPERIENCE.
We are now five years further on, In June 1995. Since January 1990 my heart and health have not improved. By-passes cannot be considered (at the moment) because the situation, as the cardiologist says, is too widespread. Following this crisis, when I had my first out of body experience, the CHU cardiologist decided to implant a "Palma Schatz" stent.
This is the first time this operation has been held at the CHU and will be undertaken with the help of an American surgeon. In 1991, 93 and 95 I had to undergo three coronary interventions for unstable angina. But, during this last intervention in June 95, the examination went badly wrong. A "trainee" accidentally tore an artery. The following is my understanding of the events following the explanations that they were kind enough to give me.
The next morning I am in intensive care, on the cardiac by-pass. "There is nothing to lose" !! (these were the words of the cardiology team to my wife, I am not going to quote the name of the doctor who said it) "This is the last chance (for him), we have to go for it !"
So here I am, in the operating room, under general anaesthesia, completely unconscious.
My chest is (cut) open and my left leg also. I later learn that the leg was utilised to provide veins (grafts). The professor teacher is present, a surgeon, the anaesthesiologist, my doctor, some nurses and a lady who is not very proactive, but talks a lot.
She speaks in a voice that seems to me abhorrent. She says what I feel today are crazy things about the situation (they are observing). Some laugh, others are impassive. My GP, who is also a friend, is a rather serious man and stands behind the operating table. In fact, they just lost me!
Ah, yes I forgot to tell you, for a long time I'm (back up) in my "cloud" and I'm observing this entourage working around my body. It's the same kind of feeling as during the first experience. Once again, I am "aware" of the situation and the reality. I'm in a dark atmosphere (in his position up in the air) with a very bright centre, (presumably the illuminated area from the power of the overhead lighting). I perceive the lady's derogatory words about me. The sadness of my doctor. The anxiety of them all; their feeling of failure, even panic in some. Feelings that I absolutely do not share.
(on the contrary) I feel calm and peaceful. I watch dispassionately. I can see through the bodies of the participants my own stretched out unconscious physical body, disemboweled in its entirety, the blood and the perceptible cold of it... but that (the cold) I do not feel. I see myself cut open in two places ... exposed there, by the blinding overhead light, white (skin colour) and raw (flesh).
This time I do not feel a semblance of pity, but a rejection of this body ... no, this cannot be me, it is too disgusting! I hardly recognize it (me). Like that lady, I probably take a step back (recoil). Rereading my notes (that I made later), I ask myself the question, is it after this out of body experience that I was having these feelings? I will say afterwards, it seems to me that being "cloudy" (in that cloud/vapour state as Monsieur Chanet describes how he felt he was ) I was indifferent. I wake up, I'm in the recovery room, according to the nurses and doctors taking turns at my bedside "everything went very well" …
(however, I am thinking) "It's not good to lie to the ex-dead!" (things of course did not go well but they did not know that he knew that)
Everything is memorized, internalised, engraved deep within me. It is a terrible ordeal that I've just experienced. Because I did not want this body anymore! I was reinstated back into it by force. Of life ? By science and medical technology? But life in this body will never be the same; I now (sort of) carry this body. And this body drags me, me...the "cloudy guy!" Because I'm really light when I'm free. This body...it continues to play with me...it is necessary, he (it) is me...the human. And I have to accept this union again. And this darned heart continues to have "episodes" (in 2001, in 2005 and in 2006 it, until the installation of a Cypher stent finally stabilized me).
Monsieur Chanet then describes a lengthy period when he suffered some kind of a breakdown. He was treated for this in a six week period during which he suffered [i][i]intrusive hallucinations he described as nothing like his out of body experiences. [/i][/i]
These hallucinations are nothing like what I experienced at the time of the operation.....
For me the proof that what I had experienced during the out of body experience was that it was deep rooted in me, probably in my subconscious. And that these (mentally) recorded images (of his body cut open) would reappear in me and cause stress. Still today it takes a lot of courage for me to share this episode. My goal is not to proselytise, but to try to understand this "phenomenon". (I must add) I began with sleep disorders, apnea, hypopnea, nightmares and more hallucinations which left me in a state of physical exhaustion which only resolved after (new) tests in February 2013 prescribed by a different cardiologist.
Of course, before all that, I had revealed this experience to my doctor. He listened to me and was amazed at my description of the operation. How did I know about the presence of the lady in question and her words (which I cannot however reveal)? I could not possibly have been aware because I was under anaesthesia and monitored!
What I know, in any case, is that this scene is engraved in me, inscribed in my memory, but even more so in my subconscious. (And) The relationship with my body has since changed. I don't care (much) about it ... I guess I am different from those people's testimonials where they say that after this kind of experience they wish to enthusiastically live this newfound earthly life.....
As for my GP, who is also a friend, It is important to know however that there was a professional "reserve" (discreetness) on his part, but there was also an explicit confirmation (from him) that the facts that I reported to him were indeed correct and of the order of reality. That indeed the people present were certainly those who I quoted and that "ice" had been used during the operation. That yes, I had been "lost" (during the operation) …his discretion rather focused on the content of the "infamous" words of the lady present, without denying the inappropriate part of those (her) remarks. He also expressed his astonishment at the description I gave him of the situation.
Many thanks to Guy Chanet for kindly allowing me to post his experiences !
From a programme discussion on the subject, this is a report from Frenchman Bruno Camilleri who suffered a heart attack with two cardiac arrests while playing golf. He described himself later in the video as a very down to earth type who would not have believed such a thing was possible...but because it happened to him he had to accept it.
That is one of the reasons I find the never ending resistance from sceptics to be untenable. Once again, they might like to ask themselves, if it happened to them, why do they
presuppose that their interpretation of the event would be any different than this clearly intelligent and articulate individual ?
(Not verbatim, less than one quarter of the dialogue)
Interviewer/host :
You were the victim of a cardiac arrest in February, in fact you had two cardiac arrests
Bruno Camilleri :
What happened was I was playing golf and I had a heart attack with two thrombosis' that required paramedics to attend. The first thrombosis caused a brief cardiac arrest and then I had a second thrombosis which caused a severe (prolonged) cardiac arrest, which needed two or three electric shocks and that's when I had an extraordinary experience.
What I experienced was, I slipped into a very calm world, bathed in a soothing light, and found myself in a position above the scene. I saw what was going on outside and inside the truck (where he was being defibrillated). I was not concerned about the feelings of everyone around me. I felt very comfortable, an intense happiness.
Host :
The people involved confirmed everything and what was said ?
Camilleri :
Yes, I saw several events that were verified. I saw a friend phone my companion to explain what had happened leaving messages as to why I hadn't arrived. I saw the paramedics giving me heart massage and defibrillating me and I saw the club secretary and all the people gathered there.
The male host briefly outlines the process of defibrillation and that it would cause pain in a conscious person.
Camilleri :
No pain, when I was in this state. I was bathed in this intense light, I felt an incredible happiness, incomparable to anything on earth.
Male host :
To the point where you wanted them to let you go ?
Camilleri :
That is true, yes and then suddenly everything stopped and I found myself on a stretcher with an oxygen mask on my head and the knees of the emergency physician around my ears upside down behind me and my body completely racked with pain, returned to consciousness and all the worries
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cgjbIDxkJxw
An Italian NDE documentary with experiencers and commentary from doctors and nurses.
If you select the English translation version, what you will get is just about enough (in most cases) to be able to understand what is being related.
It might be better (the text works quite well) to start with the pensioner, Grazia Cini, (@ 6.50) who relates her out of body experience during a hospitalisation after falling off a horse. She had the classic out of body experience, seeing her body below, being able to read the thoughts of the people around her and seeing outside into the hospital garden before the transition into the light.
At 10.23, nurse Anna Siboni (who is researching this phenomenon) relates the experience of two people who suffered cardiac arrests, one being able to accurately describe the medicines he was administered etc.
At 32.44, she relates a very interesting case of a blind music teacher, who was resuscitated from ventricular fibrillation. He excitedly reported being able to see in colour, objects, what they were wearing, including a particular bracelet on the anaesthesiologist's wrist. This case supplements and adds weight to the reports previously related by Vicki Umipeg (now Blazon) and "Brad" for instance.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Scj3JkHokb8
Following on from that, this is the case of an Italian advertising executive, Mario Dalla Torre Schio, who after a very serious head on car crash, experienced a profound NDE during which he met his deceased Grandmother, who made him go back to his body.
More interestingly, during his 'out of body experience' when he was observing the medical staff working on him (his 'dead' body) he saw one of the doctors "manipulating" or "manhandling" him in a manner which he found objectionable (for whatever reason). This doctor was particularly "distinctive" but (to Dalla Torre) clearly not in a positive way.
When he awoke from his coma, he wanted to know where this particular doctor was, that had manhandled him, only to hear that he had actually died five years previously. Although I find this type of report hard to accept, Dalla Torre appears to be sincere and I have heard of this type of curious occurrence before.
https://www.nderf.org/Italian/mario_d%27...talian.htm Note : I tried to link to the English translation but couldn't.
Edit: Typoz kindly provided the English translation from NDERF (posted below) which I did not originally use. I only later discovered that Dalla Torre's experience was registered there.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ekDAS8kLO9U This you tube interview is in Italian, I've only posted it to show that his experience has become quite a big talking point in his country.
Excerpt less than one quarter of the full text.
I heard everything that they (the doctors and nurses) said; it was as if I were watching a film of myself. I (my body) was wearing a black track suit that a nurse was cutting with scissors. A 'short' doctor with curly/spiky hair and a short beard was intubating me and I felt pain and discomfort in the body. I knew that tormented body was me, but I didn't wonder how I could be in two places at once; I simply thought it was the most normal thing in the world.
Instead I cursed that curly haired doctor who was working on me, and I said to him "
You ugly porcupine, stop tormenting me, can't you see I'm fine, leave me alone!" But this doctor who seemed the most agitated, did not give up and continued to fumble about my body, passing his hands over my chest and spreading a blue light. I came to know later that in this situation, the doctors believed me to be clinically dead and had already thought about the possibility of the removal of my organs.
Instead I woke up unexpectedly after about two days (but I was talking and writing "upside down") After a few days I managed to regain my normal language - but I was left with this incredible ability to instantly remember all the words - and asked the nurse where that short, curly haired doctor was (the porcupine) who had "mistreated me" (or saved my life?) during the coma. She was astonished and asked me how I could see what was happening around me, since my eyes had been closed and I was practically dead.
Then she brought me a photograph of a group of doctors and nurses at a party and I told her (pointed him out to her) which was the 'porcupine' doctor: he was standing in the foreground, being very short in stature. And this is what I said,
"
Where did he go? I have not seen him anymore, is he perhaps on vacation?"
Those present were astounded and replied:
"
Yes, actually this doctor did work here, in intensive care, but he died a few years ago!"
I was stunned and moved, completely bewildered.
Very similar to the report from Mario Dalla Torre (above), Bill English, a 41 year old American father from Utah, was equally severely injured when the quad bike he was riding, flipped over on him.
He reported two near death experiences during periods in coma and in the first one, claims to have seen (from a position above) his dead relatives placing their hands on his body (for whatever reason). This occurred during a real physical "religious blessing" apparently.
It doesn't prove anything but it's interesting that these things seem to occur everywhere.
https://www.kued.org/whatson/utah-conver...tin-tanner go to 6.10
Dale Chormanski was on his way home from a Bruce Springsteen concert in Cleveland Ohio, when he experienced sudden cardiac arrest and died. His daughter (who was driving) pulled over in an underpass and dragged him out of the car to perform CPR, having previously called for help.
Whilst he was dead (he claims) he clearly remembered seeing (from above) the EMT's lifting his body into the ambulance. They were all dressed in their dark coloured uniform/overalls but there was another "figure" there (with them) apparently, which ties in with the two reports above.
Chormanski is well aware that some people will think "he's nuts" but states he is just relating what he saw.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ez5LjiI4vfU
He was inspired to write a book which is available to read in part here. (note to moderators this is available on line but if I've broken any rules by linking to it, feel free to delete it.
https://books.google.co.uk/books?id=FE1u...ce&f=false