Even After $100 Billion, Self-Driving Cars Are Going Nowhere

Isn't this comment veering into the realm of politics?

David

I think its important to touch on this to make a point about the article, as long as the "political"  part doesn't get discussed any further.

I think its important to touch on this to make a point about the article, as long as the "political"  part doesn't get discussed any further.

Well as you know, I have political views as well, but I have been persuaded that mixing politics with psi is too explosive for anything useful to emerge.

I know very well what "the elites" are, and I don't like them any more than Max does, but I can't see how any reference to them can be other than political!

When I joined Skeptiko, it seemed to be more or less completely focused on the same subjects that we are focused on - it just seemed to slide over time.

Feel free to delete this message if you think it will help.

Anyway, enough said!

David

AFAICTell the elites are the ones pushing driverless car tech at the expense of the "little guy", not the other way around?

But yeah to go any further than acknowledging the disagreement is prolly beyond the scope of this forum.

Back to the main topic ->

Elon Musk’s Big Lie About Tesla Is Finally Exposed

More than 2 million of the cars are being recalled — because Tesla’s “self-driving” systems have always been anything but

Well as you know, I have political views as well, but I have been persuaded that mixing politics with psi is too explosive for anything useful to emerge.

AI is more intrinsically linked to politics than to psi!

Back to the main topic ->

Elon Musk’s Big Lie About Tesla Is Finally Exposed

I thought that was a very interesting piece (which I hadn't read when I made my comment about the psychological danger of being asked to supervise a car which usually makes the right choices!

In any case, there are a lot more uses for a car that can really drive itself, as opposed to one that requires constant supervision:

Sending kids off on trips before they can drive themselves.

Coping with the time when you are no longer considered fit to drive yourself for one reason or another.

Travelling while drunk or fatigued or emotionally upset.

Sending the car off to a liquor store to buy more whiskey Some people already call a taxi firm and ask them to buy a bottle and deliver it. They will do it for a price!

Etc etc.

@Silence - do you ever worry that you will get out of real driving practice?

David

Here is a rather interesting article about self-driving vehicles, in of all places Evolution News!

https://evolutionnews.org/2024/01/artifi...nest-toil/

Or consider what fully automated driving would look like in Moldova. A U.S. acquaintance who visited that country was surprised at how Moldovan drivers avoid mishaps on the road despite a lack of clear signals and rules about right of way. When he asked his Moldovan guide how the drivers managed to avoid accidents in such right-of-way situations, the guide answered with two words: “eye contact.” Apparently, the drivers could see in each other’s eyes who was willing to hold back and who was ready to move forward. This example presents an interesting prospect for fully automated driving. Perhaps we need “level 6” automation (level 5 is currently the highest), in which AI systems have learned to read the eyes of drivers to determine whether they are going to restrain themselves or make that left turn into oncoming traffic.

The roads round where I live aren't as complicated to drive as Moldovan roads, but they certainly do not resemble US highways, but then neither do some of the more scenic backroutes in Colorado, and many other places.

He provides a lot of links, and this one looks interesting:
https://billdembski.com

David

A sign of the times: growing public hostility to self-driving cars in the places where they are most being tried out (like San Francisco).

From https://www.vice.com/en/article/3akeev/a...it-on-fire :

"A crowd swarmed a Waymo self-driving car in San Francisco on Saturday night, pummeling the vehicle with cans, a skateboard, and eventually setting it on fire. It’s a wild scene, emblematic of the ever-growing hostility between San Francisco residents and the big tech companies that use the city’s public streets as a testing ground for self-driving cars.

A Waymo spokesperson said in a statement to Motherboard that nobody was hurt in the incident. “At approximately 9 PM on Saturday, February 10th, a fully autonomous Waymo vehicle was navigating through San Francisco when a crowd surrounded and vandalized the vehicle, breaking the window and throwing a firework inside, which set the vehicle on fire,” the spokesperson wrote. “The vehicle was not transporting any riders and no injuries have been reported. We are working closely with local safety officials to respond to the situation.”
..........................
The presence of self-driving cars in the city has been controversial. Last week, a Waymo vehicle struck a cyclist, leading to minor injuries and sparking a regulatory review. Waymo, which is owned by Google parent company Alphabet, said that the person was “occluded” by another vehicle. Other self-driving car incidents in San Francisco have been more severe. In October, a woman who was hit by a human-driven car fell into the path of a Cruise driverless vehicle which dragged her 20 feet. Cruise initially omitted this in its description of the incident to California’s DMV, prompting the agency to suspend the company’s license.

Saturday’s outpouring of public rage and the shocking images that resulted are hardly surprising.

A sign of the times: growing public hostility to self-driving cars in the places where they are most being tried out (like San Francisco).

From https://www.vice.com/en/article/3akeev/a...it-on-fire :

Inevitable when governments collude with corporations to experiment on citizenry.

And even this group of protesters created zero loss of life, which means on balance they are more responsible than Big Tech companies...

Quick update on Tesla's newest software update to its self driving tech.

They pushed out a revamp (supposedly based on the emerging LLM tech) to all Tesla owners and gave a free month's worth of "supervised" FSD (full self driving).  I've been "testing" it and must admit its been a quantum leap over the prior version I'd last tested (Aug 2023).  It has not made any safety-related mistakes so far and has struggled primarily with somewhat vague/nuanced lane expansion/merges.  Its much more "human like" in its operation: naturally accelerating, keeping general pace with traffic, etc.

I just used it this morning to make a 2 hour drive and it pretty much took me door to door.  I only disengaged the FSD a few times because I'm an impatient driver and had to speed around a few slowpokes in the slow lane (on the highway).

Thought I'd share.

Quick update on Tesla's newest software update to its self driving tech.

They pushed out a revamp (supposedly based on the emerging LLM tech) to all Tesla owners and gave a free month's worth of "supervised" FSD (full self driving).  I've been "testing" it and must admit its been a quantum leap over the prior version I'd last tested (Aug 2023).  It has not made any safety-related mistakes so far and has struggled primarily with somewhat vague/nuanced lane expansion/merges.  Its much more "human like" in its operation: naturally accelerating, keeping general pace with traffic, etc.

I just used it this morning to make a 2 hour drive and it pretty much took me door to door.  I only disengaged the FSD a few times because I'm an impatient driver and had to speed around a few slowpokes in the slow lane (on the highway).

Thought I'd share.

Interesting, but I have a friend who's grandfather smoked around a pack a day and never got cancer. [Sometimes people get lucky, but the proof will be in the next few years.

And as I often post, if the companies themselves were confident in their product they wouldn't try to stop local governments from putting restrictions on them. Instead they lobby at the state & federal level to try and avoid any additional regulations.]

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Confused Waymo Cars Block 101 On-Ramp In Potrero Hill, Then Go Down Closed Road

Joe Kukura

These are fairly vague explanations  of what actually happened and why. But it appears that Waymos got confused and stalled, human divers intervened and moved the cones, which led to different behavior by the Waymos. So one thing the robot cars may not have figured out yet is how to respond when human drivers take matters into their own hands.

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Senate Democrats urge crackdown on autonomous vehicles and driver assist

Andrew Hawkins

“We cannot allow partially automated driving systems and ADS to accelerate the road safety crisis,” they write. “NHTSA must take firm control of the wheel and steer manufacturers towards prioritizing safety.”

They urge NHTSA to use its recall authority to prohibit some driver-assist features from being used on certain roads. The senators say that NHTSA missed an opportunity to put limits on Tesla’s Autopilot earlier this when it recalled the feature over concerns about drivers using it on roads where it wasn’t intended to operate.

“We remain concerned that Autopilot, and features like it in other vehicles, could lead drivers to become overconfident and distracted, putting them and other road users at risk,” Blumenthal and Markey write in a letter to NHTSA Acting Administrator Sophie Shulman.