Death is the end

I just love how this thread was made to make skeptics look more 'rational' by saying that they will "simply accept it". Bullshit, I have seen enough people die to know that the vast majority react with nothing but fear.

Just think back to distant prehistoric times. Whole human species lived then became extinct: The things they knew where lost. So be it too for our species if we don't leave this planet before our Sun becomes a red giant. When it does it will roast our life bearing planet to a toasty cinder destroying all life.

No existential dread, just acceptance.

I'm not sure what you're trying to say here; if you're claiming that ancient Man simply accepted his fate, that's rather presumptuous of you. If you're implying that's what people should do; if it's that easy for you, then frankly, I don't think you've thought through all the implications.

Mom: "Go on....get up already an' go out and look for a job."

Sorry, Ipso

I'm lost that's okay though

Unfortunately we don't know what happens after the body is irreversibly dead. Suggesting somehow you can know, and posing a hypothetical question based on that knowing makes little sense to me, because it's simply not possible to know.

But I'm open minded, and that for me is the only logical position to take. Life appears to go on after people die, many of us will have experienced the loss of a loved one, or good friend, gone through the grieving process and found that life just continues onwards. I don't know what that means, but life doesn't appear to end when people die.

Our 3+1 dimensional system (spacetime), might be a very useful way to understand information from the point of view of adding it up (past information which sums to the present through coherence), but it might be - for example - that the underlying information is actually organized as 2+2 dimensions and we're actually understanding the interactions of two x 2D informational surfaces. My concept of time might be an irrelevance, and things might not connect up in three dimensions properly after all.

It just doesn't make sense to ask the question, and expect to get any sort of meaningful answer. We are were we are, and neither you or I seem able to know what happens after death - whilst we're alive.

"Unfortunately we don't know what happens after the body is irreversibly dead."

Yes we do, Max. People were irreversibly dead (after their hearts stopped) before the discovery in 1957 of CPR and it's first application in 1960. Irreversibly dead. Now we can bring them back from that state and we know very well what happens.

I'm not sure what you're trying to say here; if you're claiming that ancient Man simply accepted his fate, that's rather presumptuous of you. If you're implying that's what people should do; if it's that easy for you, then frankly, I don't think you've thought through all the implications.

You wrote: "Certain New Atheists (and their acolytes in pop culture) have used the "born from nothing, return to nothing" concept as a source of comfort: nothing gained, nothing lost, as it were. I big to differ; after a lifetime of experiences, if death is it, then everything is lost."

I'm not saying that at all. I am saying individuals of extinct human species full of experiences have lived and died. All of their experiences have been lost. Their existence means nothing. So too will our experiences be lost and our existence mean nothing if we dont leave this planet. There is no existential meaning. In a nutshel it's all for naught to fret over.  You've got to take a non parochial perspective. Personally it would be nice to know, not hope, death is not the end. I'm inclined to death is final.  I've had a during my lifetime a lot of personal experience with death. I accept that likelyhood without angst. It's a position I have never wavered from.

My own take on this is that if people realise death is the end and embrace it then life will be seen as more precious to them, for example they will realise that it only comes once to each person therefore they will appreciate it more, it is more special. You will try and achieve more in your life and appreciate the one life that you have.

A lot of crimes have been linked to peoples belief in an afterlife. Look at those suicidal bombers and terrorists, they do not appreciate life because they think they live forever.

My own take on this is that if people realise death is the end and embrace it then life will be seen as more precious to them, for example they will realise that it only comes once to each person therefore they will appreciate it more, it is more special. You will try and achieve more in your life and appreciate the one life that you have.

A lot of crimes have been linked to peoples belief in an afterlife. Look at those suicidal bombers and terrorists, they do not appreciate life because they think they live forever.

No, I think that's a completely unreasonable view to take. I mean, what some of the more intelligent people in this have pointed out is key - there is absolutely, positively nothing in this scenario. There's no point in appreciating anything. There is no point... to literally anything. I was going to comment on what Steve001 said, by saying that he probably just hadn't really thought all that hard about it, but Will beat me to it. 

Your last sentence is nonsense. There have likewise been plenty of crimes committed by atheists and materialists in the name of nihilism. It's a non sequitur. 

Trying to somehow paint a demonstrable, nihilistic end in that rosy light might seem nice to you, or some other reductive atheist who isn't believing in an afterlife (or really anything) in any capacity whatsoever, but as tim pointed out, it's just a lack of acceptance of the real implications of that belief system. Life is not precious in that situation - life is nothing. I would think that if this were true and every single person knew about it, many would live their lives the exact same, just with an increased sense of depression and dread. I would guess that many people would be substantially more self-serving, since in that universe there's really little point to being excessively nice or caring about others (there's actually no point to it, save preserving your own ultimately worthless life a tad longer than otherwise, perhaps). You just ostensibly just get by by not being a dreadful person, and just kind of do as you please otherwise. I think plenty would take that approach as well. (If this sounds unsavory to you, consider that it would cause people to live and act in a way that most people would consider to be antithetical to human feelings, intuition, and emotion - might there be something to that?)

What I am very, very confident of, though, is that it would not make people have some mystical and lovely appreciation for life. If you hadn't taken notice, plenty of very religious people already live the way you mentioned, because they believe it's what God wants or it'll help them get into heaven. So for those people, no, your scenario would not apply. The vast majority of people on Earth believe in some form of an afterlife one way or another, and there's not, nor has there ever been, some mass suicide as people rush to the afterlife.

For whatever it's worth, I don't really know exactly what I believe in terms of specifics as far as an afterlife goes, but I sure as hell know that I believe something is going, whatever that thing is. To me, there's too much evidence to look the other direction or act like there isn't "more to it" than just this life from a reductive standpoint. As others have noted, the sheer absurdity of this life would, in your scenario, be maddening and depressing, regardless of how people chose to live their lives if it were true.

My own take on this is that if people realise death is the end and embrace it then life will be seen as more precious to them, for example they will realise that it only comes once to each person therefore they will appreciate it more, it is more special. You will try and achieve more in your life and appreciate the one life that you have.

A lot of crimes have been linked to peoples belief in an afterlife. Look at those suicidal bombers and terrorists, they do not appreciate life because they think they live forever.

I would guess that as many or more crimes are committed by people who think this is their one shot at life, and they better get everything they want cause they will not get another chance. Just a guess.

Also, I'm thinking generally criminal behaviors often seem to be to be born of emotions like: greed and hate and angst. My experience is that none of these things are in great supply with people who truly believe in continuation of consciousness.