Aware II results

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(2023-01-24, 08:18 AM)sbu Wrote: What are your sources?

Sorry for responding late, but Pam Reynolds, the shoe OBE and Van Lommel's teeth study are some.
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https://medium.com/@rorycockshaw/heres-w...a7f89901ef
Thoughts? 
I personally found this dissertation underwhelming with the exception of the REM intrusion point.
(2023-02-03, 05:13 PM)quirkybrainmeat Wrote: https://medium.com/@rorycockshaw/heres-w...a7f89901ef
Thoughts? 
I personally found this dissertation underwhelming with the exception of the REM intrusion point.

Quick skim shows he hasn't really read up on NDEs in the larger historical venue. Shushan has documented cases where NDEs actually influence the culture rather than just culture influencing NDEs.

But as his title notes he seems to be a materialist-atheist fundamentalist so nothing will convince him.

"The man who wants to beat a dog always finds his stick."
   - Serbian proverb
'Historically, we may regard materialism as a system of dogma set up to combat orthodox dogma...Accordingly we find that, as ancient orthodoxies disintegrate, materialism more and more gives way to scepticism.'

- Bertrand Russell


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(2023-02-03, 06:12 PM)Sciborg_S_Patel Wrote: Quick skim shows he hasn't really read up on NDEs in the larger historical venue. Shushan has documented cases where NDEs actually influence the culture rather than just culture influencing NDEs.

But as his title notes he seems to be a materialist-atheist fundamentalist so nothing will convince him.

"The man who wants to beat a dog always finds his stick."
   - Serbian proverb





It was posted on AwareofAware by a "doubter" but I knew it would be disappointing as soon as I saw him citing Keith Augustine.
Also some comments called this out.
(This post was last modified: 2023-02-03, 07:33 PM by quirkybrainmeat. Edited 1 time in total.)
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(2023-01-23, 09:39 PM)sbu Wrote: Interestingly the preprint paper mentions my own major concern with all these Internet NDE accounts/retrospective accounts collected many years after the fact:

What is that concern if you don't mind me asking?
(2023-02-03, 05:13 PM)quirkybrainmeat Wrote: https://medium.com/@rorycockshaw/heres-w...a7f89901ef
Thoughts? 
I personally found this dissertation underwhelming with the exception of the REM intrusion point.

Outdated 'skeptical' objections - I wish materialists would sometimes be more skeptical of their own assumptions and biases and those on 'their side'. I agree the REM point is interesting, but doesn't really explain or tell us much.

The author also said that most verifiable OBE's have occurred after the person is safe i.e declared alive. This is just patently false - every OBE during an NDE I have read has ended when the person was resuscitated. Also the fact people have had verified out of body perceptions is pretty amazing - but the author skims over this fact!
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(2023-02-03, 05:13 PM)quirkybrainmeat Wrote: https://medium.com/@rorycockshaw/heres-w...a7f89901ef
Thoughts? 
I personally found this dissertation underwhelming with the exception of the REM intrusion point.

According to Bruce Greyson, Kevin Nelson's study showed that the rate of REM intrusion symptoms in NDErs was no higher than the rate of the same symptoms in a random sample of the general public.

General anesthesia suppresses REM brain activity.

Measurements of REM brain activity in people who have had NDEs show that it is lower than in other people.

(Greyson, 2021, p. 109)
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(2023-02-04, 12:18 PM)Roberta Wrote: What is that concern if you don't mind me asking?

Regarding the non-prospective part of the study they write:

Quote:However, differences in time from CA onset to recall may introduce bias
(2023-02-03, 07:29 PM)quirkybrainmeat Wrote: Keith Augustine.

I find him rather odd. He seems to be convinced that NDE's have a physiological explanation even though that is absolutely not supported by the evidence or where the propective research is pointing. I could be wrong but I can't see where a physiological explanation could possibly come from, now. They've thrown everything at it, what's left.
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https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/article...n_sectitle
This paper seems recent. Any thoughts on it?
Edit: Lol it sounds rather disappointing. A recycling of hipoxia and DMT explanations.
But the interesting part is the G-LOC tests. Is there any info on them?
(This post was last modified: 2023-02-08, 05:55 PM by quirkybrainmeat. Edited 2 times in total. Edit Reason: More info )

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